Hollosi Information eXchange /HIX/
HIX HUNGARY 864
Copyright (C) HIX
1996-12-02
Új cikk beküldése (a cikk tartalma az író felelőssége)
Megrendelés Lemondás
1 Re: The English Patient (mind)  28 sor     (cikkei)
2 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  11 sor     (cikkei)
3 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  43 sor     (cikkei)
4 Re: *** HUNGARY *** #862 (mind)  28 sor     (cikkei)
5 Re: Nadia Comaneci / Kemenes Ilona (mind)  17 sor     (cikkei)
6 PETITION to ARREST war criminals ..Karadzic, Mladic.. (mind)  915 sor     (cikkei)
7 Help!please translate this document! (mind)  9 sor     (cikkei)
8 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  21 sor     (cikkei)
9 Help required!!! (mind)  217 sor     (cikkei)
10 Re: Finnish related to Turkish? (mind)  486 sor     (cikkei)
11 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  64 sor     (cikkei)
12 Re: EE environment (fka HAPPY THANKSGIVING) (mind)  68 sor     (cikkei)
13 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  33 sor     (cikkei)
14 Re: Subduing the Earth (was "Happy Thanksgiving!") (mind)  34 sor     (cikkei)
15 Re: EE environment (mind)  54 sor     (cikkei)
16 Re: EE environment (mind)  46 sor     (cikkei)
17 Re: AUTO Justice in Hungary (mind)  43 sor     (cikkei)
18 Re: EE environment (mind)  53 sor     (cikkei)
19 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  36 sor     (cikkei)
20 Re: AUTO Justice in Hungary (mind)  21 sor     (cikkei)
21 Re: EE environment (mind)  12 sor     (cikkei)
22 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  27 sor     (cikkei)
23 Re: Help!please translate this document! (mind)  37 sor     (cikkei)
24 Re: Nadia Comaneci / Kemenes Ilona (mind)  31 sor     (cikkei)
25 Re: To the debate of Joe and Johanne (mind)  34 sor     (cikkei)
26 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  13 sor     (cikkei)
27 Re: Nadia Comaneci / Kemenes Ilona (mind)  16 sor     (cikkei)
28 Re: EE environment (mind)  64 sor     (cikkei)
29 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  29 sor     (cikkei)
30 Re: Help!please translate this document! (mind)  15 sor     (cikkei)
31 Re: EE environment (mind)  140 sor     (cikkei)
32 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  35 sor     (cikkei)
33 Re: To the debate of Joe and Johanne (mind)  11 sor     (cikkei)
34 Hungarian beer (was: MALEV) (mind)  40 sor     (cikkei)
35 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  39 sor     (cikkei)
36 Re: EE environment (fka HAPPY THANKSGIVING) (mind)  53 sor     (cikkei)
37 Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind)  7 sor     (cikkei)

+ - Re: The English Patient (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 12:50 PM 12/1/96 -0400, you wrote:
>
>
>On SCM, Joe raised the question of why Ondaatje, which doesn't sound like a
>Hungarian name (I think it may be Dutch and that he originally came from
>South Africa, but I am not positive), would have selected such a small
>country to be the homeland of his hero. Does anybody have any ideas?
>
>U:dvo:zlettel,
>
>Johanne/Janka

I seem to recall reading about a (Count?)  Almasy as an Africa
traveller/adventurer.  As I recall, he crossed Northern Africa by car in the
1920, when such automobile endurance trips were fashionable.  What I
remember the most about the trip is that at one point he was trying to cross
the Nile and he needed a larger boat to ferry his car across. They
recommened to him that the residents of a nearby island may help.  It turned
out that the islanders, who lived rather isolated from the rst of the
natives, were in fact Hungarians, who were settled there by the Turks as
Janisseries (sp?). Although they were of the muslim religion, they
nevertheless kept their Hungarian language.  During the 1930's they sent
several visitors to Hungary and they in turn were visited by Hungarian
scientists.

regards,

Charlie Vamossy
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 08:33 AM 12/2/96 +0100, Lajos MONOKI > wrote to Peter
Soltesz:

<snip>
>You mean that Hungarians living in Hungary are mainly dumbs, only those who
>left they homeland are good ones? Don't be silly!

I'm afraid that that's exactly what Mr. Soltesz means.  And that logic makes
him one of the smart Hungarians because he had the good sense to leave.

Joe Szalai
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

>
>                               Inquiry on MALEV
>
>   From: 
>   Reply to: 
>   Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 07:11:03 -0600
>   Organization: Deja News Usenet Posting Service
>   Newsgroups:
>          hun.news,
>          soc.culture.magyar,
>          bit.listserv.hungary,
>          hun.net
>   Followup to: newsgroup(s)
>
>Except on <http://www.travelfirst.com>;, do you know any homepage about
>MALEV on the net' ?
>You who travelled with this airline, please provide us reports and
>opinions concerning comfort, F&B, security, service.
>Thank you very much.
>Inirsort Bourges
>E-mail:>
><http://www.travelfirst.com>;
>-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet



        Two years ago I've chosen Delta to fly to Hungary
        with  1) I'm a Delta freq. flyer and 2) the fact
        that I would be landing in Budapest at 7:30 a.m.
        without having to change planes first in another
        city in Europe.

        Malev is as good an airline as any of the other
        major carriers regarding comfort, timeliness,
        service, security -- my only negative thought is
        I dislike supporting a government that parades
        the same old faces with different titles.....

        If that is no consideration for you, I would
        encourage you to reserve a seat.

        Julie
+ - Re: *** HUNGARY *** #862 (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 04:56 PM 12/1/96 -0500, Marie Antoinette, err, I mean, Alexander Szegedy
> wrote:

<snip>
>Boy, was I wrong! I naively thought that I live in the freest country in the
>world, in a country where the standard of living is the envy of the world,
>and because of these things, immigration has to be curtailed by law. But you
>straightened me out! Now I am trembling because of the high crime rate (have
>you heard that the crime rate in America is significantly declining?),
>obviously you rather heard that "education is in decline". I have some other
>discouraging news for you: most of the Nobel prizes are awarded to this
>terrible country. And about your cavalier remark on medicare, of which you
>obviously know nothing. I happen to be on medicare, and with a supplementary
>insurance, my medicare does not cost me a red cent, and I receive the best,
>most sophisticated medical service in the whole world.
>And about declining income for 75 million Americans. I don't know where you
>got this information, it sounds like a page fromn an old Pravda. The fact
>is, that the economy is good, the average income is constantly rising, most
>of those who are left behind, have an aversion for  a 4 letter word: WORK.
>But cheer up my Canadian neighbour, good old America is still here. So when
>you cross the American border next time, you still may rush to buy American
>goods, because they are obviously less expensive. And I could go on to
>describe life in America, (bad and good), but I do not want to spoil your
>fun this holiday season.

I'm very happy that you're very content.  Really.  I am.

Joe Szalai
+ - Re: Nadia Comaneci / Kemenes Ilona (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >,  says...
>
>Olvastam, hogy Nadia Comaneci (Kemenes Ilona) egy magyar apja van
>(Gheorgie Comaneci - Kemenes Gyvrgy) is ezirt Ilona egy filszarmasz
>magyar. De azt nem hittem... Nadia Comaneci (fil)-magyar szarmasz
>ember-e? Rigen hallottam ezt. Mig nem biztos vagyok.
>
>Peter Chong
>
>Ui. Mi tvrtint Ilonaval 1980 utan? Kmvancsi vagyok...
>
>
>I thought her name is Anna, not Ilona, but I may be wrong.  I don't know
wht happened to her after 1980.  When she was here during the olympics,
she spent a few days in the Laurentians in the same camp as my daughter.

Agnes
+ - PETITION to ARREST war criminals ..Karadzic, Mladic.. (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

B o s N e t  -  November 29, 1996
> =========================================================================
             Also available on Usenet as BIT.LISTSERV.BOSNET
_________________________________________________________________________
To subscribe/unsubscribe to BosNet send message to 
                 subscribe   bosnet-digest [your e-mail address]
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For the list of commands send "help" message to 
_________________________________________________________________________
   PETITION to Arrest Karadzic and Mladic

                         WE NEED YOUR SIGNATURE!

 English:

 We the undersigned feel that it is the moral duty of our governments
 to order their troops in Bosnia to immediately arrest Radovan Karadzic
 and Ratko Mladic- who have been charged by the International War
 Crimes Tribunal at the Hague with genocide and crimes against
 humanity.

 Bosnian:

 Potpisnici ovih redova osjecaju da je moralna duznost nase vlade da
 naredi svojim trupama hapsenje Radovana Karadzica i Ratka Mladica koji
 su optuzeni za ratne zlocine i zlocine protiv covjecanstva na sudjenju
 u Internacionalnom Tribunalu za ratne zlocine u Den Hagu.

 German:

 Die Unterzeichner dieser Petition betrachten den Befehl zur Festnahme
 des Radovan Karadzic und Ratko Mladic von der Seite unserer Regierung
 als ihre moralische Pflicht. Die beiden sind beim Internationalen
 Kriegsverbrecher Tribunal in Den Haag fuer die Kriegsverbrechen und
 das Verbrechen gegen Menschlichkeit verurteilt worden.

 French:

 Nous, soussignes, croyons qu'il est du devoir moral de nos
 gouvernements de donner l'ordre a nos troupes en Bosnie d'arreter
 immediatement Radovan Karadzic et Ratko Mladic qui ont ete
 formellement accuses de crimes contre l'humanite et de genocide par le
 Tribunal international de La Haye.

Italian:
I sottoscritti sentono obbligo morale di nostro governo di ordinare al
proprio esercito, presente in Bosnia, immediato arresto di Radovan
Karadzic e Ratko Mladic, ricercati da Tribunale Internazionale di Aia
per crimini di guerra e crimini contro l humanite.



To sign or to help circulate the petition please contact:


Dzevat Omeragic: 

or

Stephen Albert: 


Damir Tomicic                    >
Nuremberg, Germany

Omer Ayan (Australia, Visegrad)  >
Almasa Ayan (Australia, Zivinice)
Suleyman Ayan (Australia, Visegrad)
mr. Sabit I. Milinkich (Australia, Tuzla)
Dr. Mustafa Karavdic (Australia, Visoko)
Alija Ramic (Australia, Rogatica)
Muriz Delic (Australia, Sandzak)
Kasim Dlakic (Australia, Visoko)
Nazif Efica (Australia, Sarajevo)
Asja Efica  (Australia, Sarajevo)
Dzevdet Alic (Australia, Srebrenica)
Bayron Helich, OAM,JP (Australia, Sanski Most)
Sydney, Australia

Nalini Lasiewicz                 >
Los Angeles, USA

Jonathan Kofman                  >
Sahza Hatibovic-Kofman
London, Ontario, Canada
Tilla Kofman, Quebec, Canada

Vanja Filipovic                  >
Senka Filipovic
Mirza Filipovic
Haverford, USA

Edin Omeragic                    >
New Jersey, USA

Dinko Dedic                      >
UK

C. Benjamin Flynn                >
Haverford, USA

Naida Lacevic                    >
Baltimore, USA

Aris Basic                       >
Germany

Agostinho M. Silva Ferreira      >

Dzenan Sahovic                   >
Ume=E5, Sweden)

Dr. Boris Voh                    >
Suzanne Nashem Voh
USA

Jane Floor                       >
Stavanger, Norway

Galina Schneider                 >
USA

Muhidin (Dino) Lelic             >
Brooklyn Park, MN, USA

Mirna Dzamonja                   >
Madison, Wisconsin

Adnan Smajlovic                  >
Irena Smajlovic
Mississauga, Canada

Ognjen Sokolovic                 >
Mississauga, Canada

Boris Petrovchich                >
American Committee Supporting
DEMOCRACY IN BOSNIA AND CROATIA
USA

Glenn Ruga                       >
Friends of Bosnia, Western Massachusetts
USA

Kenan Avdic                      >
Sweden

Mirela Avdich                    >
Christopher Barone
Havertown, PA, USA

Aida Premilovac                  >
USA

Faris Hadrovic                   >
USA

Nusret Suvalic                   >
Zagreb, Croatia

James Lockwood                   >
USA

Paul Garrin                      >
USA

Edvina Uzunovic
Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

Dubravka Bodulovic               >
Zeljko Bodulovic
Canberra, Australia

Marko Puljic                     >
USA

Safet Mangic                     >
Australia

Alma Begicevic                   >
Chicago, USA

Izudin Lelic                     >
Brooklyn Park, MN, USA

Amir Imamovic                    >
Austria

Julie Pavlon                     >
Florida, USA

Memisevic Ermin                  >
Wien, Austria

Murat Erkocevic                  >
Milpitas CA, USA
Jocelyn W.L. Lau
Santa Clara, CA, USA
Fehma Erkocevic
Tuzla, Bosnia and Herzegovina

Nader Hashemi                    >
Ottawa, Canada

Michael A. Sells                 >
Haverford, USA

Ursula Lindenberg                >
Bradford University, UK

Ivica Zaher                      >
Croatia

Len Biser                        >
USA

Frank Tiggelaar                  >
Ahmed Chamka
Eudia & Esdey Simson
Mirenko Ivir
Amsterdam, Holland

Thomas Cushman                   >
Wellesley, MA, USA

Richard J. Green                 >
Stanford, CA, USA

Namik Hrle
Boeblingen, Germany

Kemal Krulch                     >
Sudbury, Ontario, Canada

Emir Arslanagic                  >
USA

Dr. Robert Aziz Mayanovic        >
USA

Jean Roy                         >
Marie Sterlin
David Muhlstock
Maureen Doyle
Stephane Gelinas
Ruth Albert
Beverly Smith
Diane McAuley
Sian Robinson
Barb Howard
Emma  Mason
Deena Mayken
Montreal, Quebec, Canada

T.T. Gerritsen                   >
Holland

Mahir Sokolija                   >
Sejdefa Sokolija
Naser Custovic
Dinka Custovic
Almedin Salcin
Amela Salcin
Hamdija Alibasic
Mustafa Ohranovic
Melbourne, Australia

VELIMIR WITTNER                  >
ALAN WITTNER
VJERA WITTNER
Zagreb, Croatia

Mike Rothenberg                  >
Stanford, CA, USA

Tomislav Kundic                  >
Pasadena, CA, USA

Lisa Gleeson

Stanko Barle                     >
Stony Brook, NY, USA

Ubejd B. Mujagic                 >
AK, USA

Sheri Fink                       >
Stanford, CA, USA

Nermin Zukic                     >
Ottawa, Canada

Snjezana Delibasic               >
Samir Delibasic
Mississauga, Ontario, Canada

Emin Kulic                       >
Saudi Arabia

Dzevad Muftic                    >
Johannesburg, South Africa

Susan Cairn                      >
Rich Cairn
Minneapolis, MN, USA

Dzevat Omeragic                  >
Nermana Foco
Nidzara Omeragic
Hamilton, Ontario, Canada

Jasminko Beso                    >
USA

Dragan Mirkovic                  >
Ames, IA, USA

mladen komnenic                  >
BC, Canada


Nora Gaines                      >
New York, New York, USA

Davor Wagner                     >
Syracuse, NY, USA

Edis Tokovic                     >
Detroit, MI, USA

Miro Curac                       )
Nick Curac
Linda Curac
Tamara Curac
Ivan Curac
Petromila Rabak
Mike Rabak
Susan Rabak
Marion Rabak
Davis, CO, USA

Vesna Karavdic                   >
Munib Karavdic
Wollongong, Australia

Michael R. Foreman
Maurice, La, USA

Samir Camdzic                    >
USA

Susan Silk                       >
Bob Silk
USA

Catherine Hudson
Hamilton, ON, CANADA

Omer A. Suleimanagich
Los Angeles, CA, USA

Richard Weijens                  >
Haarlem, Nederland

Peter Lenstra                    >
The Netherlands

Marco Dings                      )
The Netherlands

J.A.J. Engelen                   >
The Netherlands

Ruud Olthoff                     >
Westerhaar, The Netherlands

Jaap van den Berg                >
The Netherlands

hanskp                           >
The Netherlands

Adi Imsirovic                    >
London, UK

Jaap Kries                       >
Den Bosch, The Netherlands

Erwin Hans                       >
Alkmaar, The Netherlands

Edwin  van Dongen                >
Tilburg, Holland

Erik Zebregs                     >
Den Bosch, The Netherlands

G. Huigen                        >
Eindhoven, Holland

HUSO NERETLJAK                   >
Sweden

Andrea Kramer                    >
Amsterdam, Holland

Jill Rogers                      >
Albany, CA, USA

Jaap Kloosterziel                >
Epe, The Netherlands

Bart-Jan Flos                    >
Tilburg, The Netherlands
013-5433683

Jeffry van Meer                  >
Roosendaal, The Hetherlands

Mauricio Guzman                  >
USA

Almin Muratagic                  >
Sweden

Andrew Boyd                      >
Jamaica Plain, MA, USA

Hako Olevic                      >
New York, USA

MIdhat Voloder                   >
Sweden

Mediha Fejzagic DiMartino        >
Mirza Ajanovic
Dijana Ihas
Sandra Horo
Amela Hadzihasanovic
Nermin Hadzihasanovic
Gerald DiMartino
Robert Kaplan
Janine Kaplan
Jody Brass
Irena Petkovska
Paul Abrams
Linda Gulicia
Jerry Gulicia
Lara Maniaci
Sead Fejzagic
Kanita Fejzagic
Besim Fejzagic
Muvedeta Fejzagic
Ferhat Fejzagic
Jasmina Kamal
Eyad Kamal
San Francisco, CA, USA

Gert Bijl                         >
Nieuwegein, The Netherlands

Dirk Koster                       >
The Netherlands

Lotte Ivarson                     >
Sweden

Kvesic Zeljko                     >
Ulm, Germany

Terence Tynan                     >
Portland, OR, USA

Mirza Balic                       >
Atlanta, GA, USA

Jon Ingjaldsson                   >
Bergen, Norge

Charles Fox                       >
Santa Monica, CA, USA

Vesna Mutevelic                   )
Lamar, TX, USA

Dragan Jadric                     )
Lamar, TX, USA

Almir Dulic                       )
Lamar, TX, USA

Senaid Tahirovic                  >
Santa Clara, CA, USA

Alija Kajan                       >
Sydney, Australia

Andras J. Riedlmayer              >
Cambridge MA, USA

Peter Zrinski  Olofstrom, Sweden
Robert Zrinski Olofstrom, Sweden
Annette Wanggard-Zrinski  Olofstrom, Sweden
Birgitta Zrinski Olofstrom, Sweden
Stefan Zrinski Olofstrom, Sweden
Ingela Johansson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Osmo Karjalainen  Olofstrom, Sweden
Wera Joensson Olofstrom, Sweden
Olli Vierikko  Olofstrom, Sweden
Mikael Hakansson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Leif Adolfsson  Nasum, Sweden
Christer Svensson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Olle Nilsson  Ryd, Sweden
Ronny Joensson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Rikard Joensson Olofstrom, Sweden
Roger Joensson  Ljungby, Sweden
Stig Andersson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Viola Nilsson Olofstrom, Sweden
Annika Zbasnik   Olofstrom, Sweden
Janez Zbasnik  Olofstrom, Sweden
Ewy Pettersson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Jasna Orazem  Dolenja Vas, Slovenia
Marjan Orazem Dolenja Vas, Slovenija
Elisabeth Danheden  Olofstrom, Sweden
Faith Asekenye  Olofstrom, Sweden
Magnus Weidner  Olofstrom, Sweden
Zvonimir Jonjic  Olofstrom, Sweden
Kristina Olsson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Karin Olsson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Margaretha Olsson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Sigurd Magnusson  Nasum,Sweden
Marjatta Golubow  Olofstrom, Sweden
Eivor Backstrom  Olofstrom, Sweden
Siv Zukiewicz-Bergstrom  Olofstrom, Sweden
Maria Golub  Olofstrom, Sweden
Anita Thomasson Jamshog, Sweden
Siv Bromster  Olofstrom, Sweden
Ingvar Kajrup  Olofstrom, Sweden
Ewy Lesonen  Olofstrom, Sweden
Magnus Eskilsson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Helmer Torstensson  Nasum, Sweden
Lillemor Blomquist  Olofstrom,Sweden
Gert Karlsson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Sven Martensson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Edith Stumm  Olofstrom, Sweden
Ingegerd Tuorila  Nasum, Sweden
Timo Tuorila  Nasum, Sweden
Eva Lenshof  Jamshog, Sweden
Lisbeth Widerstrand  Olofstrom, Sweden
Bengt-Ake Svensson  Bromolla, Sweden
Kaarina Westberg  Kallinge, Sweden
Bjorn Olofsson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Gerda Carlsson  Kyrkhult, Sweden
Karl-Erik Karlsson  Kyrkhult, Sweden
Stig Jeppsson  Olofstrom, Sweden
Radi Pezo  Olofstrom, Sweden
Marija Jonjic  Olofstrom, Sweden
Tonka Pezo  Olofstrom, Sweden
Ante Jonjic  Olofstrom, Sweden
Tomislav Mamic  Olofstrom, Sweden
Ivan Pezo  Olofstrom, Sweden
Dubravko Pezo  Olofstrom, Sweden
Marino Jonjic  Olofstrom, Sweden
Anton Monas  Olofstrom, Sweden
Julianna Pannonberg  Olofstrom, Sweden
Zdravka Pezo Olofstrom, Sweden
Slava Jonjic  Olofstrom, Sweden
Jadranka Mamic  Olofstrom, Sweden

Adam Benovic                       >
Croatia

Said Bosnjakovic                   >
New Jersy USA

Bill Jungels                       >
Fredonia, NY, USA

Dr. Dunja Maglica
Andrei Maglica
Antonija Maglica
Samir Kulenovic
Melita Huremovic

Sharon Machlis Gartenberg          >
Framingham, MA

Jolanda Pikkaart                   >
Holland

T.R.Logan                          >
Redlands, CA, USA

Maciek Tryburcy                    >
Poland

Amer Smajkic                       >
USA

R.Adil Kurtic                      >
Tuzla, Bosnia-Herzegovina

Samir Lipovaca                     >
New York, USA

Sead Makota                        >
Toronto, Ontario, Canada

Emir Ibrahimpasic                  >
St. Paul, MN, USA; Modrica BH
Ibrahim Ibrahimpasic
Lincoln, NE, USA; Modrica BH
Refija Ibrahimpasic
Lincoln, NE, USA; MOdrica BH
Emira Ibrahimpasic
LIncoln, NE, USA; Modrica BH
Alija Ibrahimpasic
Lincoln, NE, USA; MOdrica BH
Saladin Cerimagic
Minneapolis, MN, USA; Prijedor BH
Alma Orucevic
Minneapolis, MN, USA; Sarajevo BH
SUljo Linic
West Chester, PA, USA; Bos. Petrovac BIH
Omer Car
Goshen, IN, USA; Livno BiH

Edin Kadribasic                    >
Copenhagen, Denmark

Jay Taylor                         >
Arizona, USA

Darko Kozina                       >
Sweden

Robert Popovic                     >
Sweden

Zukic Ismet
Zukic Katja
Behidza Znidarec
Hajrija Azabagic
Sliskovic Karlo
Sliskovic Azemina
Sliskovic Ronald
Sliskovic Inga
Dinko Tuhtar
Dinka Tuhtar
Matea Tuhtar
Daria Tuhtar
Mirsad Kalic
Elvira Kalic
Gafic Dzemal
Rizvanovic Mehmed
Rizvanovic Salina
Rizvanovic Hanka
Tankovic Ahmed
Tankovic Abida
Hrustic Hamed
Hrustic Dinka
Hrustic Sema
Dzenanovic Irman
Balic Sead
Hamzic Medijana
Hamzic Ahmed
Hamzic Halima
Sehic Osman
Sehic Ifeta
Sehic Sanela
Huzejrovic Razim
Huzejrovic Muharem
Huzejrovic Asija
Huzejrovic Amira
Hamzic Samir
Hamzic Nevresa
Karajic Mirsad
Karajic Suada
Husic Esnaf
Baljic Bahra
Baljic Adnan
Tankovic Said
Tankovic Edina
Hadzic Kemal
Hadzic Naza
Hadzic Mernisa
Kozenjic Mustafa
Kozenjic Zejna
Tankovic Sead
Balic Ali
Balic Rabija
Balic Suad
Balic Adila
Balic Zulto
Balic Emka
Balic Nihad
Balic Safet
Balic Hasan
Balic Arifa
Alekic Sehrija
Alekic Ramo
Kos Ediba
Kos Mustafa
Kos Aldina
Kos Almina
Turabija Fatima
Amidzic Esad
Amidzic Safeta
Zildzic Azra
Zildzic Hajrudin
Zildzic Dzenana
Zildzic Enisa
Ibrahim Bjelic
Hovo Bjelic
Fikret Bjelic
Irso Bjelic
Mujo Karabegovic
Dijana Karabegovic
Ademi Samir
Ademi Nihad
Tankovic Devleta
Zukic Jasmin
Jaksic Mujo
Planincic Mustafa
Planincic Ramiza
Planincic Zlata
Planincic Medina
Kemo Husein Spahic
Balic Almira
Dzihic Midhet
Luciano Rosani
Turabija Enver
Turabija Amela
Delic Hasan
Delic Hatidza
Delic Nermin
Delic Melinda
Dzinic Mevresalisa
Dzinic Emira
Zejnic Muharem
Zejnic Habija
Zec Hasan
Zec Mustafa
Peles Amra
Peles Slaven
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada

Margarethe Persson
Vilshult, Sweden
Lars-Peter Runesson
Kyrkhult, Sweden
Lena Persson
Olofstrom, Sweden
Madeleine Bjorkhem
Jamshog, Sweden
Inger Bos
Nasum, Sweden
Annika Nilsson
Dalanshult, Sweden
Agneta Holgersson
Olofstrom, Sweden
Pia Alfredsson
Morrum, Sweden
Inga Ohlsson
Olofstrom, Sweden

Olly Willans                        >
Caroline Earnshaw
Mark Lynas
Caroline Lowes
USA

Tom Gallagher                       >
Bradford, UK

Brenny Hansma                       >
Holland

Shin Yasui                          >
Matsuyama, Japan
Eugene, Oregon

Pierre Tremblay                     >
Bois-des-Filion, Quebec, Canada

Sakir Hadzimejlic                   >
Jasminka Hadzimejlic
Sydney, Australia
Amir Suljic, Blacktown, Australia
Vesna Suljic,Blacktown, Australia
Safet Suljic, Blacktown, Australia
Safija Suljic, Blactown, Australia
Ana Matic, Blacktown, Australia
Zelimir Matic, Blacktown, Australia
Dika Hrnjadovic, Blacktown, Australia
Asmir Hrnjadovic, Blacktown, Australia
Zehra Hrnjadovic, Blactown, Australia
Fuad Hrnjadovic, Blactown, Australia
Ifeta Hrnjadovic, Blactown, Australia
Nezir Kazic, Lane Cove, Australia
Vahida Zelihic, Lane Cove, Australia
Sevda Kazic, Lane Cove, Australia

Iniciativa Socialista               >
Madrid. Spain

Michelle Croy                       >
Waltham, MA, USA

Roberto Ortiz de Zarate             >
Bilbao, Spain

Powerful Choices I Am Your Witness Campaign >
Cody Sontag
Judith Roth
Cris Sontag
Jude Kaftan
Kristan Marra
Morgan Sontag
Kathy Chludzinski
Jim Lyman
Fidel Garcia
Gordon Wahto
Joan Wahto
Dina Blade
Kathy LeMay
USA

Sanja Hrle                          >
Joy Bale
Ahmed Moussa
Simon Park
Kate Park
Alison Whitle
Sydney, Australia

Kirk Johnson                        >
Worcester, Massachusetts, USA

Jeanie Nine                         >
Carmichael, CA, USA

John Palmer                     >
Cornell, USA

John H. Weiss                   >
Cornell, USA

Salim Milinkich                 >
Hajrudin Kamenjas
Ismet Halilovic
Samir Skopljak
Mirela Skopljak
Semka Basic
Safet Avdic

Tony Langford                   >
London, UK

Jonathan Kofman                 >
London, Canada
Joseph Stein, NH, USA
Elizabeth Hall, NH, USA
Scott Sobozenski, NH, USA
Julie Ann Lake, VT, USA
Jody S Hauser, VT, USA
Tal Bass, VT, USA
A Tyl, ME, USA
S Townsend, MA, USA
Dan Glass, MA, USA
Debrah Grupp, MA, USA
B Nilson, MA, USA
DR Suelson, United Kingdom
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Bronwen Denomere, NY, USA
Cathleen O'Connell, MA, USA
Dan S Grimmes, MD, USA
Michael Levy, CA, USA
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Karen Ramsey, CT, USA
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Jeff Nyhan, CT, USA
Sarah T Mirmfor, MD, USA
John Ristlen, NH, USA
Jenn Moore, NJ, USA
Marin C Aguinaya, NJ, USA
Alex Bluvias, NJ, USA
Christina W Abramson,NH, USA
Carolyn D Greenspan, MA, USA
Dawn Miller, NH, USA
Eber Heasley, NH, USA
Ufaria Josi Terena, S Paulo, Brazil
Ellen Glynn, VT, USA
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Emily Sasa, MA, USA
Audrey Renland, MA, USA
Nancy, Daxel, VT, USA
Roland Lambert, VT, USA
Sam Brush, ME, USA
Peter R Thomas, ME, USA
Brett Houth, MA, USA
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Brooke Rietveld, NY, USA
Eric Smaagaavd, VT, USA
Angela Beauclerc, CA, USA
Bryon Gomberg, PA, USA
Kimberley Healey, PA, USA
Jessica Ojala, VT, USA


_________________________________________________________________________
   Opinions expressed/published on BosNews/BosNet-B do NOT necessarily
   always reflect the views of (all of the members of) Editorial Board,
   and/or moderators, nor any of their host institutions.
+ - Help!please translate this document! (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

I've been told this is my grandfather's report card from 1895-96, but
noone in the family can translate it. The top line reads: A szerednyei
rom. kath. elemi nepiskola igazgatosagatol.  Incription reads:  Yerabek
Sandor ung megyei szerednyei szuletesu, 11. even, rom. kath. valla  (can't
read) tanulo as 1895-96 tanevben (can't read) rom. kath. elemi nepiskola
Vin osztalyat bevegezven, kovetkezo bizonyitvanyt nyert.
Of course there's more. Can you help me out. I'd like to find this town
and go visit
  This is for my wife. Please reply to 
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >, 
says...
>
>Except on <http://www.travelfirst.com>;, do you know any homepage about
>MALEV on the net' ?
>You who travelled with this airline, please provide us reports and
>opinions concerning comfort, F&B, security, service.
>Thank you very much.
>Inirsort Bourges
>E-mail:>
><http://www.travelfirst.com>;
>-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
>      http://www.dejanews.com/     Search, Read, Post to Usenet


I have travelled last year by MALEV from London to Budapest and back to
London.  It was in every respect up to standard compared to my
experiences with other airlines (Air Canada, British Airways, Swissair,
and many others).  Any travel agent could give you information.

Regards, Agnes
+ - Help required!!! (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

I read a post similar to this some time ago and it worked wonders.  I

encourage you to do the same.



The internet has grown tremendously.  It doubles in size every 4

months.  Think about it.  You see those "Make money fast" posts more and

more.  That's...because it WORKS!  So I thought, all those new users

might make it work.  And I decided to try it out, a few months ago.

Besides, what's $5.00.  I spend more than that in the morning on the way

to work for smokes and drink.  So, I sent in my money and posted.

Everyone was calling it a scam, but there are so many new users from

AOL, Netcom, etc. they will join in and make it work for you.



I have already began recieving money in the mail and to tell you

honestly, I couldn't believe it!  Not just a little, I mean big bucks!

At first only a few hundred dollars, then a week later, a couple of

thousand.  I am still excited to see how it is going to turn out.  My

expectations grow each day as more comes in.  It comes from all over the

world.  And every bit of it perfectly legal and on the up and up.  I've

been able to pay off numerous bills and plan to use the rest for an

exotic honeymoon after I get married in May.



Not only does it work for me, it works for others as well.  Markus

Valppu says he made $57,883 in 4 weeks.  Dave Manning claims he made

$53,664 in the same amount of time.  Dan Shepstone says it was only

$17,000 for him.  Do I know these people?  No, but when I read how they

say they did it, it made sense to me.  Enough sense that I'm taking a

similar chance with $5.00 of my own.  Not a big chance, I admit, but one

with incredible potential, because $5.00 is ALL anyone ever invests in

this system. Period. That's all Markus, Dave, and/or Dan invested, yet

their $5.00 netted them 10's of thousands of dollars each, in a safe,

legal, completely legitimate way.  Here's how it works in 3 easy steps:



Step 1:



        Invest your $5 by writing your name and address on 5 pieces of paper

along w/ the words "Please add me to you mailing list".  This way, your

paying for a legitimate service.  Fold a $1 bill, money order, or bank

note inside each paper and mail them by standard US mail to the

following 5 addresses:



1)      Steve Boltinghouse

        1009 Bird St.

        Placerville, CA  95667



2)      Riccardo Cuffaro

        Via Bondano 75, 54037

        Massa (MS)  Italy



3)      Brian White

        354 Briarwood Dr.

        Johnstown, OH  43031



4)      Miguel Quesada

        Urb. Jose Ma Zeledon, A-33

        San Jose, Costa Rica



5)      Rick Miller

        7519 Sage St.

        Manassas, VA  20109-7211





Step 2:



Now remove the top name from the list, and move the other names up.

This way, #5 becomes #4 and so on.  Put your name in as the 5th one on

the list.



Step 3:



Post the article to at least 250 newsgroups.  There are at least 19000

newsgroups at any given moment in time.  Try posting to as many

newsgroups as you can.  Remember the more groups you post to, the more

people will see your article and send you cash.



Step 4:



You are now in business for yourself and should start seeing returns

within 7-14 days!  Remember, the internet is new and huge.  There is no

way you can loose.



Now here is how the system works:



Out of every block of 250 posts I made, I got 5 responses.  Yes, just

5.  You make $5.00.  This is at #5.



Each person who sent you $1 also makes 250 posts with you at #4, 1000

postings.  On average then, 50 people will send you $1.  That's $50

bucks!



Now these 50 people make 250 posts with you at #3, or 10,000 posts.

Average return, 500 people = $500.  They make their 250 posts with you

at #2.  100,000 posts = 5000 returns at $1 each totalling $5000.



Finally, 5000 people make their 250 posts each with you at #1 and you

are returned a total of $60,000 before your name is dropped off the

list.  And that's only if each person ONLY makes 250 posts each.



>From time to time, when you see your name is no longer on the list you

take the latest posting you can find and repeat the whole process.



The results depend on you.  You follow through and repost this article

everywhere you can think of.  The more postings you make, the more money

you make.  It is too easy and too cheap to pass up!!!



That's it.  Pretty simple, huh?  But, believe me, it works!  There are

millions of people surfing the net everday, all day long, all over the

world.  100,000 new people get on the net everyday.  You've seen it in

the papers.  So, simply follow these steps and play fair.  That's the

key and that's all there is to it.
+ - Re: Finnish related to Turkish? (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

---------------------------------17164731315494
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Here's a little blurb I typed up on Edit in response to a Mr. J. Pearson
who originally asked whether Finnish is related to Turkish... It took me
a while to type up but it's here as an attachment... Feel free to browse
through it and make comments...

Cheers

Peter Chong

---------------------------------17164731315494
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain

In a way, it really depends on whose side your on... If you're a "clumper"-
type linguist, (i.e. a linguist who prefers to group languages into large
super-families) then Turkish is related to Finnish by way of the Ural-Altaic
or Turanian hypothesis/relationship. If you're a "splitter"-type linguist,
(one who prefers to make many subdivisions within a language family -
emphasizing the difference of one language to another) then Turkish belongs
to the Altaic family while Finnish belongs to the unrelated Uralic family.

The arguments for the "Ural-Altaic" relationship include:
1) Almost all Uralic and Altaic languages have vocal harmony.
2) The U-A languages are agglutinative - they pin suffixes at the end of
words to express various grammatical and stylistic nuances.
3) They employ postpositions rather than prepositions.
4) U-A languages do not have a seperate verb "to have".
5) U-A languages do not tend towards consonant clusters.
6) There are many lexical and grammatical correspondances.

The Ural-Altaic theory would include both the Uralic and Altaic language
families. Some Uralic tongues include: Finnish, Estonian, Hungarian, Mari,
Mordvin, Lappish, Karelian, Khanty, Udmurt, Komi, Nenets, Nganasan and
Sholqup. Some Altaic tongues include: Turkish, Khalkha Mongolian, Kalmuk
Mongolian, Burjat Mongolian, Kazakh, Kyrgyz, Uzbek, Yakut (Sakha), Tuvinian,
Tatar, Bashqort, Uigur, Manchu, Ewen, Ewenk, Salar, Sibo, Udegey and
Azerbaijani. Some linguists also believe Korean is Altaic and a few even
believe Japanese is Altaic. (It is my belief, that not only there is an Ural-
Altaic or Turanian unity but that the Sumerian language of antiquity [the
inventors of writing ~ 4000 - 2000 BC] is the common root to all modern U-A
languages.)

The biggest argument against this U-A unity is:
1) Many linguists do not consider such features as agglutination and vowel
harmony as proof of a relationship. Moreover, the lexical and grammatical
similarities could be the result of long contact between the Uralic and Altaic
peoples rather than a common origin. (Author's note: This is possible but
should not be considered definite.)

Before circa 1950, most linguists believed in a Turanian or U-A linguistic
relationship. However after that time, it was assailed by linguists as a
tenuous theory and that it would be better to consider the Uralic and Altaic
families as seperate. In some cases as in Hungary, this was done for
political reasons (the predominating belief among the Hungarian fascists and
conservatives of WWII was that the Hungarians represented the westernmost
branch of a Turanian people. A people that could be found from Europe all the
way to Japan - another member of the Axis powers. Thus it was a favoured
theory of the nationalists and fascists. While no doubt these supporters
evoke scorn and hatred among many liberal and leftist people today, the
theory itself isn't completely wrong.)

If you're still interested check out this WWW page:
HTTP://EXO.COM/~FREDH/LANGUAGE.HTM.

Some Sumerian morphemes and modern U-A words.

(Source: Cso"ke, S ndor, "Sum r-finn-mongol-t r k  sszehasonl!t" nyelvtan",
Buenos Aires: Magyar O"skutat s Kiad sa, 1974. - Sumerian-Finnish-Mongolian-
Turkish Comparative Grammar)

Sumerian:       bur 411,104 (to drill, to riddle with holes)
Finnish:        porata (it drills)
Hungarian:      f#r (")
Turkish:        burgu (drill - noun)
Kalmuk Mongol:  burgu (")

Sumerian:       bar 74, 68/302 (family, village)
Finnish:        perhe (family)
Hungarian:      v ros (city)
Old Turkish:    balIq (")
Mongol:         balgasun (city, village)

Sumerian:       bur3 411,32 (livestock, four-legged animal, cow)
Finnish:        poro (reindeer)
Hungarian:      borj# (livestock)
Osmanli Turk:   buzagI (two year-old livestock)
Buriat Mongol:  bur  (livestock)

Sumerian:       bad 69,100 (to fall apart, to be fallen)
Finnish:        potea (it breaks apart)
Hungarian:      sz tpattan (" - "sz t-" is a prefix meaning "apart". "pattan"
                            is the root meaning "break".)
Turkish:        patlamak (to burst)
Mongol:         butal- (it falls apart)

Sumerian:       bad 152 8,4 (wall, stuffing)
Finnish:        pato (stuffing)
Hungarian:      fal (wall)
Kyrgyz Turk:    bit  (it closes away - pertaining to arrows?)
Mongol:         biteg  (closed away)

Sumerian:       gab 167,55/57a (to grasp, to get, to catch)
Finnish:        kaapata (it gets, it catches)
Hungarian:      kap (")
Turkish:        kap (pot - recepticle, something that catches)
Mongol:         qabla- (it catches, it finds)

Sumerian:       ab(-ba) 128,13a (father)
Finnish:        appi (father-in-law)
Hungarian:      apa (father)
Turkish:        aba (")
Mongol:         aav (")

Sumerian:       s^ub 68,9 (to flatten)
Finnish:        lappea (page)
Hungarian:      lap (")
Sakha Turk:     s bird x (page, leaf)
Kalmuk Mongol:  napts^i (leaf)

Sumerian:       gab 167,56 (copy, picture, duplicate)
Finnish:        kuva (picture)
Hungarian:      k p (")
Turkish:        k p (")
Mongol:         keb (example, as in...)

Sumerian:       gib-i/=gig/446,3/4 (be sick, pain, illness)
Finnish:        kipe  (sick)
Hungarian:      meggebed (it is sick - "meg-" is a prefix)
Turkish:        gebermek (to pass away)
Manchu:         gebsere- (be sour)

Sumerian:       gir11 152,19 (to stretch)
Finnish:        kire  (tight)
Hungarian:      g rcs (spasm)
Turkish:        germek (to tighten)
Mongol:         kere- (it binds up, it tightens)

Sumerian:       sig 592, 10ff (tight, narrow)
Finnish:        tiukka (tight)
Hungarian:      szu"k (")
Turkish:        sIkI (")
Mongol:         siqam (tight, pressed together)

Sumerian:       gig 456,43 (hatred, to hate)
Finnish:        kiukka (hatred)
Hungarian:      gyu"l l (it hates)
Old Turkish:    k k (")
Mongol:         j^igs^i (")

Sumerian:       s^ag5 356,5/7 (be healthy, good, goodness, nice)
Finnish:        hyv  (good)
Hungarian:      j" (")
Turkish:        sag^ (healthy)
Bashqort Turk:  hau (")
Mongol:         sajin (good)

Sumerian:       sig7 351,6 (to live, to sit)
Finnish:        sija (dwelling, place)
Hungarian:      sz k (chair)
Turkish:        sakIn (inhabitant)
Mongol:         sagu- (it sits, it dwells)

Sumerian:       gis^ 296,10 (man, master, sir, gentleman)
Finnish:        is nta (sir, landlord)
Hungarian:      gazda (landowner?)
Old Turkish:    iy  (gentleman)
Mongol:         ej^en (sir, ruler)

Sumerian:       gal2 80,3 (to be)
Finnish:        olla (to be)
Hungarian:      val- (it is - old form)
Turkish:        ol- (it is, it will be, it happens)
Mongol:         bol- (it is, it will be, possible)

Sumerian:       gur4 483,23 (to run, to flee)
Finnish:        kiire (rushing, hurrying)
Hungarian:      gyors (quick)
Turkish:        kuriye (fast movement?)
Mongol:         qurdun (fast)

Sumerian:       zag 332,43 (flatland, field)
Finnish:        s vel (flat)
Hungarian:      s!ks g (plateau)
Turkish:        sahra- (steppe, land, plateau)

Sumerian:       dug3 396,10/11 (good, healthy, optimal)
Finnish:        t ysi (full, perfect)
Hungarian:      t k letes (complete, perfect)
Turkish:        tekmil (completion)
Mongol:         t g s (")

Sumerian:       dah 169,3/10 (one follows, by someone)
Finnish:        l het  (it follows, it comes together)
Hungarian:      t rs (member, partner)
Sakha Turk:     dogor (")
Mongol:         daga- (it follows, it goes together)

Sumerian:       kud 12,19 (city, hamlet)
Finnish:        kotia (hut)
Hungarian:      kunyh" (")
Old Turkish:    qadas^ (relative, relation, troop, brother)
Mongol:         quda (relation, troop)

Sumerian:       kad4 (to bind)
Finnish:        kytke  (it binds up, it weaves)
Hungarian:      k tni (to bind)
Turkish:        kat- (weave)
Mongol:         qadamar (strenghtened)

Sumerian:       bad3 152^8,7 (deathly ill, sickly)
Finnish:        potea (become sick)
Hungarian:      beteg (sick)
Old Turkish:    bed- (it weakens)
Mongol:         betege ("dagantot okoz" betegs g" - My Hungarian isn't very
                         good but I know it has something to do with illness)

Sumerian:       pa 295,11 (summit, peak)
Finnish:        p   (head)
Hungarian:      fej (")
Turkish:        bas, (")
Ancient Mongol: pekin (")

Sumerian:       bu 371,25 (to blow)
Finnish:        puhaltaa (it blows)
Hungarian:      f#j (")
Turkish:        p fle- (")
Ancient Mongol: p lig  (")

Sumerian:       zub 60^x,4 (to flow, rain)
Finnish:        tippua (it drops)
Hungarian:      csepeg (")
Uigur Turk:     c^ip-c^ip (onomatopaeia of dripping water - "drip-drip")
Mongol:         sibeni- (it drops, it flows)

Sumerian:       ki 461,21 (who)
Finnish:        kuka (")
Hungarian:      ki (")
Turkish:        ki (")
Mongol:         khen (")

Sumerian:       kur2 60,34 (circle)
Finnish:        keri (")
Hungarian:      k r (")
Turkish:        k resel (spherical)
Mongol:         k rd  (circle)

Sumerian:       kas^ 211a,2 (urine)
Finnish:        kusi (")
Hungarian:      h#gy (")
Turkish:        huysuzluk (bile)
Old Turkish:    qas^an- (be urinating)

Sumerian:       kud 536,4 (to throw, to place, to allow)
Finnish:        kadota (it loses)
Hungarian:      hagy (it allows)
Turkish:        koy- (")
Mongol:         qoj^im (afterwards, later)

Sumerian:       s^ita 233,15/442,2 (to bind)
Finnish:        sitoa (it binds, it weaves, it strenghtens)
Hungarian:      csatol (it weaves - a net)
Turkish:        ciltlemek (to bind)
Kalmuk Mongol:  s^itm (fencing)

Sumerian:       has^ 12,78 (be bending)
Finnish:        kallistaa (it bends)
Hungarian:      hajlik (")
Turkish:        kayma  (slant-eyed)
Mongol:         qaj^iji- (it bends, it curves)

Sumerian:       hir 401,9 (picture)
Finnish:        kirja (book)
Hungarian:      h!r (news - ?)
Turkish:        kertik (notch, gash, score)
Mongol:         kerc^i (")

Sumerian:       has^ 12,70/73 (to cut, to split)
Finnish:        halkoa (it cuts)
Hungarian:      has!t (")
Turkish:        kesmek (to cut)
Mongol:         qasu- (it shortens sg, it cuts sg)

Sumerian:       uh 398,6/17 (to spew, to vomit)
Finnish:        oksentaa (it vomits)
Hungarian:      ok dik (")
Turkish:         ks rmek (to cough)
Mongol:         oki- (it vomits)

Sumerian:       sil(a) 12,117 (to split, to cut up)
Finnish:        s le (splinter)
Hungarian:      szelet (slice - noun)
Teleut Turk:    s^IlI (it cuts)
Mongol:         silu- (")

Sumerian:       sig 592,10/19 (small, little)
Finnish:        hiukan (a little bit)
Hungarian:      csek ly (insignificant)
Turkish:        - ak (diminutive suffix)
Mongol:         c^ gen (a few, not much)

Sumerian:       sag2 295,100a (to strike, to hit)
Finnish:        haava (wound, injury)
Hungarian:      seb (")
Turkish:         arpmak (to strike)
Mongol:         s^abda- (it wounds sg/sb,)

Sumerian:       hus 565,58 (to drive)
Finnish:        kuski (driver)
Hungarian:      kocsis (driver)
                kocsi (coach - The word "coach" is derived from the Hungarian
                       but the Hungarian word comes from the Sumerian "hus")
Osmanli Turk:   qos^u (wagon, coach)
Kalmuk Mongol:  xos^ (")
Old Japanese:   kachi (a type of vehicle for nobles)

Sumerian:       s^ag 384,118/9 (to sigh, a sigh)
Lappish:        s^uokket (a sigh)
Hungarian:      s"hajtozik (it sighs)
Teleut Turk:    s zI- (")
Mongol:         sugsi- (")

Sumerian:       s^ag 384,2 (word)
Finnish:        s vel (sound, song)
Hungarian:      sz" (word)
Turkish:        s v (")
Mongol:         jabsi- (it talks a lot)

Sumerian:       s^e 367,58d (to eat)
Finnish:        sy d  (it eats)
Hungarian:      eszik (")
Turkish:        yemek (to eat)
Mongol:         j^eme (wolf food)

Sumerian:       s^ug 367,11/2 (big, be big, much)
Finnish:        luku (lots)
Hungarian:      sok (")
Turkish:         ok (")
Mongol:          ugla- (it enlarges sg, it increases sg)

Sumerian:       s^eg8 551,4 (frost, ice, cold)
Finnish:        j   (ice)
Hungarian:      j g (")
Turkish:        sog^ut (cold)
Mongol:         tsang (frost)

Sumerian:       us^ 4 536,26 (mind, intellect)
Finnish:        huja (mind)
Hungarian:       sz (")
Turkish:        us (intelligence)
Mongol:         ojun (")

Sumerian:       as^ 2 339,8 (to long for, to want)
Finnish:        isota (want)
Hungarian:       hes (hungry)
Turkish:        istemek (to want, to desire)

Sumerian:       gis^ 296,16 (hand)
Finnish:        k si (")
Hungarian:      k z (")
Turkish:        kuuvet (strength, power)
Mongol:         gesig n (member, branch)

Sumerian:       zal 231,16 (also: sal, s^al) (to see)
Finnish:        silm  (eye)
Hungarian:      szem (")
Mongol:         silibki- (it looks at sg)

Sumerian:       zal(ag) 393,5 (be lighted, star, to shine)
Finnish:        ts'ilkett  (it shines, it lights up sg)
(dialect)
Hungarian:      csillag (star)
Kyrgyz Turk:    s^olpan (Morning Star, Venus)
Mongol:         j^ilgir- (it shines)

Sumerian:       zir 84,108 (suffering, hurt)
Finnish:        s rke  (be in pain)
Hungarian:      s!r (grave; be crying)
Turkish:        sIzI (ache, pain)
Khalkha Mongol: s^arx (wound)

Sumerian:       izi 172,11/17/13 (fire, oven, ash, to flame up)
Komi (Finnic):  ezj- (it burns)
Hungarian:      izzad (it sweats)
Kyrgyz Turk:    issyk (warm - there is a lake called the Issyk-Kul - "warm
                       lake" in Kyrgyzstan)
Mongol:         isu (ash)

Sumerian:       izi 172.159 (sour)
Finnish:        etikka (")
Hungarian:      ecet (")
Turkish:        eks,i (")
Mongol:         es - (it becomes sour)

Sumerian:       zig 84,45 (to raise oneself, to get oneself up)
Finnish:        l hte  (it goes away, it starts off, it escapes)
Hungarian:      sz kik (it escapes)
Turkish:         Ikmak (to go out, to move out, to graduate)
Mongol:         segelj^e (go in a jumping manner)

Sumerian:       ri 86,41,74 (to fly)
Finnish:        r pytt   (it flies)
Hungarian:      rep l- (")
Kyrgyz Turk:    erb ng (unsupportable, cannot stand up)
Mongol:         erbeji- (it flies)

Sumerian:       sir3 152,3 (also: sur, s^ar) (to sing, song, to compose music)
Finnish:        sirist   (it chirps)
Hungarian:      csiripel (")
Turkish:        s,arkI (song)
Mongol:         j^irgi (sing a song, chirp)

Sumerian:       er 50,7 (also: ir, ur) (man, manly)
Finnish:        yrk  (husband)
Hungarian:      #r (sir, Mr.)
Turkish:        er (man, male)
Mongol:         ere (husband)

Sumerian:       bar 74,100 (to frighten oneself, to scare)
Finnish:        pel t  (it fears)
Hungarian:      f l (")
Turkish:        perva (")
Ancient Mongol: p rk  (")

Sumerian:       ur2 203,7 (underground, ground)
Finnish:        ala- (lower part)
Hungarian:      alatt (under)
Turkish:        alt (bottom)
Mongol:         ala (genitals)

Sumerian:       ma 342,98b/10 (also: ma-da) (land, earth, homeland)
Finnish:        maa (land, country)
Hungarian:      megye (county, administrative district)
Uigur Turk:     budun (folk, people)
Mongol:         aymag (county, administrative district)

Maybe the name MAGYAR ("Hungarian" in the Hungarian language) came from MA or
MA-DA...

Sumerian:       ma 233,2 (to go)
Finnish:        menn  (it goes)
Hungarian:      megy (")
Old Turkish:    man- (")

Sumerian:       ma3 233,3a (I)
Finnish:        min  (I)
Hungarian:      -m (verbal suffix for 1st person ex. esz-ik = it eats, esz-
                em = I eat)
Turkish:        ben (I)
Mongol:         minu (mine)

Sumerian:       eme 237,2 (also: ama) (mother)
Finnish:        em  (mother, woman, madam, she-)
Hungarian:      anya (mother), emlo" (breast)
Turkish:        ana (mother) emcik (nipple) emmek (to suck)
Mongol:         eme (mother)

Sumerian:       gam 362,6 (it bends over)
Finnish:        kumar- (it bends)
Hungarian:      kamp" (hook)
Turkish:        kemer (arch, vault)
Mongol:         qamar (nose - a "bent" facial feature)

Sumerian:       na 97,4 (be named, call)
Finnish:        nimi (name)
Hungarian:      n v (")
Turkish:        nam (")
Mongol:         ner (")

Finnish:        omen (apple)
Hungarian:      alma (")
Turkish:        elma (")
Mongol:         alim (")

Sumerian:       du3 230,19 (known, experienced, knowledge)
Finnish:        tunte- (it knows, it meets)
Hungarian:      tud- (it knows), tanul- (it studies)
Turkish:        tanImak (to know)
Mongol:         todad- (it enlightens sg, it explains sg)

---------------------------------17164731315494--
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Mon, 2 Dec 1996, Lajos MONOKI wrote:

> >I have flown on Malev several times from London to Budapest using an old
> >Russian built Ilushin ? (Boeing 727 copy). The flight was OK although it
>
> It must be rather a Tupolev Tu-154. Malev didn't have Ilushin jets (IL-86),
> but IL-18, which was a turboprop plane, used mainly for shorter flights (I
> have flown IL-18 at least 15 times from Budapest to Warsaw, it was a polish
> LOT plane, there were a case when the airplane was more than 10 years older
> than me - I was about 20).
<<<<< Lajos you are correct...I looked it up.
>
> >left late (the Captain and a pretty stewardess were arriving late from
> >their shopping -- last minute duty free ya know!)..  When it left London
>
> I wonder if the plane was late because of the crew. They have to board
> before the passangers:) A "before-take-off-checklist" for Tu-154 was about
> half an hour:( And they can't start it without the Captain - it needs 3
> people: Captain, Pilot, Engineer. It was not a fun to start a Tu.
>
<<<<<<<<< The point was that the pilot/captain was supposed to be with
the plane BEFORE departure time and not 30 minutes after!

> >the pilot liked to demonstrate the performance features of the aircraft,
> >right around lunch time. BTW lunch and service was good! Airplane noisy.
<<<<<<<<<< What I am getting at is that MOST good commercial planes the
turns, the climbs, and descends one can hardly tell that it is being done.
Not on Malev (at times). It is like going into the old RCA/NBC/GE
building and taking the manually operated elevators and the guy leans on
the control so that your stomach is either in you feet or in your mouth!

> This is simply Murphy's law: when the coffee is served, some turbulence
> appears:)
<<<<<<< This is on top of that...and I agree with that one.

> >Several times I flew from New York to Budapest on their new Boeing 767
> >non-stop.
> >Service on the Hungarian section needs improvement (this is a Delta/Malev
> >joint flight).  Pilot was better this time -- I guess they learned how to
> >operate a commercial plane by now!.

> You mean that Hungarians living in Hungary are mainly dumbs, only those who
> left they homeland are good ones? Don't be silly!
<<<<<<< NO I do not...what I am saying is that it is an attitude of both
the crew and the airline. It is the same attitude as one can see in
stores (even now- although it is improving) when you go in Hungary.
It is that you are doing them a favor for shppoing (or flying) woith them
and not the other way around. Perhaps they ought to be forced to fly
Singapore or any of the Asian airlines and learn about service and how it
is handled.

> >Food OK by international standards. Service was acceptable by the same
> >standards --- a ways to go before it meets Singapore Airlines or other
> >top airlines service levels.

<<<< A general comment - the food on most Malev flights is good, at times
even has that extra quality in their butter, etc. Yet at certain times
(on the long flight) there is no one to be found as they are all on a
break meaning that you cant get a drink or anything during those times.

For those who do not know, there is a Delta and a Malev section on the
Malev flights. They know if you are sitting in one vs. the other. Even
here there is a difference in service!
Peter Soltesz
+ - Re: EE environment (fka HAPPY THANKSGIVING) (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Mon, 2 Dec 1996, Lajos MONOKI wrote:
> >While Zoltan I agree with some of the things that you have said, let me
> >suggest the following:
> >
> >If you go to Budapest during the winter you will see the evidence of the
> >air pollution on the cars or any morning on the ground. The muck on the
> >cars and the streets is dark, gooey, and sticky usually about 1/8 of an
> >inch thick or more!
> >
> >Hungary still has not abandonded the 2 stroke engines in cars (Wartburgs,
> >Trabant, etc.) nor has it forbidden the outright use of coal for heating
> >(poor quality coal). Therefore one can practically choke in places like
> >Budapest and almost die in Miskolc from the thick visible pollution.
>
> It's because some people can't afford buying Mercedese or BMW or even Lada.
<<<<<<<<<<<<< No one said anything about buying mercedes or BMW. There
are many many cars that are available with less pollution.
Moreover, the fact that they use coal and every window (usually at the
bottom) there is a vent to exhaust the fumes (uncleaned directly into the
air)

> >The effluents into the Danube river from both outside and domestic
> >sources are way exceeding any known standards.  Hungary has a Loooong way
> >to go to clean up its act.  I do not ever remember being in such poor air
> >pollution even in LA (perhaps at rare times) that one can see in some
> >major cities in Hungary during the winter.
>
> I wonder what cities you mean. Of course, there are places, where the air is
> very polluted (manly where big factories, coal power plants are near the
> city). One of them is surely Miskolc, and the second one is Budapest (nat
> all the city, but big parts). Other major cities are not worse than average
> (e.g your LA).
<<<<<<<<<< You are correct that several of the cities that are close to
the factories, electric generators, etc. are very polluted.  The problem
is that they are very close to large population densities and therefore
affect many more people.
>
> >Hungarians (to the gov't) were offered special taxis to BP to enable them
> >to be recycled after two years of use as an exchange to anyone owning a
> >Trabant and other 2 stoke engines. This was denied -- it would have
> >rapidly exterminated the Trabants, et al while reducing the air pollution.
> >Why one might ask??? In my opinion they were too greedy to accept a good
> >deal.
>
> Not really. Trabant owners were offered about 200.000 Ft for their cars. But
> a new car, even a Suzuki Swift was about 1.000.000 Ft that time. It was not
> such a good deal. For 200.000 forints you could buy only a very old used
> western car (abou 10-15 years old) which is almost as environment-foely (see
> your next sentence) as a 2-5 years old Trabant:) And has much more
> mechanical problems. And spare parts are almost 10-times more expensive.

<<<<<<<<<<<< The original idea was to offer the 2 year old former taxis
with the new four-cycle engines to owners of Trabants (even exchange!)

This is waht I mean about greed --- you see how it got changed???

 >
The main air pollution comes from cars -- see USA et al....
> >the cars today have 10% of the pollution of 10 years ago (roughly) we do
> >have better air.
> >Peter Soltesz
>
> I am sure one can find a city in US, where the situation is at least as bad
> as in Miskolc.
>
<<<< Perhaps we can, but not many and it is distributed over a much much
much larger geographical area - not that makes it any better.
Peter
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >, 
) wrote:
>

>You who travelled with this airline, please provide us reports and
>opinions concerning comfort, F&B, security, service.

We flew MALEV on  the Rome-Budapest route and back in 1995.  After
Alitalia, the Rome-Budapest leg was rather ho-hum.  People used to US
airlines may have been less critical, people used to the likes of
Qantas or Singapore Airlines would have been grimacing.  Legroom on
the planes was as bad as British Airways cattle class, but it is more
tolerable for a couple of hours than for a day.

The Boeing 737 was in the stage of getting tatty: frayed edges on the
seat covers, shadows on the luggage lockers where people touch them.
Service was without a smile by burly stewardesses.  Lunch was a haphazard
collection of Hungarian processed cheese wedges and dried-out white buns,
cold meats and plenty of very poor quality Hungarian wine - the worst
way to create interest in Hungarian viticulture.

The return leg was much better, the plane was average neat by non-US
standards, the stewardesses smiling and helpful, the food still non-
descript but alright.  We drank beer.

The best thing about flying MALEV to Budapest is that one arrives at
the new terminal and does not have to endure the quaint 1960s conditions
at the old one.  Whichever way, avoid the taxis at the airport (worse
scalpers than in Mexico City) and go for the Airport Minibus service
which is cheaper for less than 4 people, neat and reliable.  On the
way back to the airport too, even at 4 a.m.

George Antony
+ - Re: Subduing the Earth (was "Happy Thanksgiving!") (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Sun, 1 Dec 1996, Johanne L. Tournier wrote:
<SNIP>
Just a comment on your last paragraph, if I may.

> I think, in other words, that God's wish would be that mankind would restore
> the land, and I think it is in our own best interest to do so. However, I
> think it is more the secular humanism which preaches that "man is the
> measure of all things" is more likely to result in dangerous hubris, that is
> the common belief among people today that we are *in control* of things,
> that we have *eliminated* contagious diseases, and can eliminate hunger, and
> so on. If we were a little more humble, and tried to do things in accordance
> with God's law, which some people would call Natural Law, we would not be
> facing potentially worse disasters down the road because of our
> short-sighted efforts to control natural forces which are really beyond our
> ability. The efforts to control the flow of the Mississippi River around New
> Orleans, and many examples of the activities of the U.S. Army Corps of
> Engineers, strike me as falling in this category.

I agree with you here and wanted to add that it also affects many,
including in Hungary, where people are allowed to build in or very close
to the rivers, Balaton, lakes, etc.

Just like in the USA we allow people to build in the Mississippi river
(the actual width is the 50 - 100 year flood stage is about 50 miles from
the current flow). Then WE have to pay for those insurance reimbursements
because those bozo's built their stuff in the river--plus polluting it
and the water tables. Ditto for those who build on the beach then the
hurricanes wipe them out and we remove the natural habitat of critical
animals and birds.

I guess it really requires better overall education and understanding of
how the environment affects everything and everyone and develop better
systems that work WITH nature rather than against.
Peter Soltesz
+ - Re: EE environment (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Sun, 1 Dec 1996, Zoltan Rakonczay wrote:
<SNIP>
>
> With respect to air pollution, Hungary is very unfortunate to be
> located in the bottom of a basin. This, combined with the commom winter
> phenomenon of thermal inversion, makes pollution
> problems much worse. Most major cities infamous for their smog are
> located in much more favourable environments (Athens, LA, London,
> Tokio). Mexico City has problems similar to ours. This only
> means that Budapest can get away with less emmission if it wants
> to meet the same standards as other cities.
<<<<<<<<<<< I agree...that is why the environment must be handled by all
of those within the basin together, else it will be very difficult to
fix it on an individual basis.

 > Another comment (maybe more interesting):
<SNIP>
> As I mentioned, much of the environmental legislation had to be
> pushed down people's throats. There are strict regulations on
> septic systems, but they are commonly and willfully violated,
> threatening the ground water. Municipal sewage systems could not
> be built in many villages (people were unwilling to buy into it)
> where villagers don't think twice before erecting outrageously
> ugly and expensive fences in front of their houses.
<<<<<<<<<< You are right, just like leaf and garbage burning in most of
Hungary is still a big practice!

 > All in all, the environment is not a high
priority in
people's > minds, but in my opinion there are broader issues behind that:
> - A general selfish behaviour, not respecting public goods and
>   common interests.
> - A general (not unfounded, but in this case unfortunate) defiance
>   of and suspicion towards government, even when it is right.
> - A lack of recognition of self-interest: smoking, drinking,
>   watching (too much) TV are prime examples, environment is just
>   one of them.
<<<<<<<<<<
You are also right. Recently when I was in Hungary, I spoke to many
people, including in government, about American and Hungarian attitudes.
They brought out the fact that in America, typically, when a study is
announced: like smoking is bad for you, etc. most Americans tend to
follow the recommendations, while in Hungary they ignore the facts or
studies.

I think that some of the above mentioned attitudes you raise came about
by the fact that the people were so downtrodden and that the communists
took everything away that the idea of it is mine and ours rarely exists
in the Hungarian mind today. Thus thinking as a people is low on their
priorities. This manifests itself in the way they look upon Hungarians
that live outside the current borders, your neighbors well being,
property or environment/

Peter Soltesz
+ - Re: EE environment (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Sun, 1 Dec 1996, Eva S. Balogh wrote:
<SNIP>
>         I think it is question of education. How much effort was put into
> educating people? How much effort was put into an anti-smoking campaign?
> Practically none. I am absolutely dumb-founded at the ignorance of people
> about health matters, for example. Conversely, my doctor relatives are
> amazed at how much I know about health matters considering that I am just a
> layman. But in the United States the media is absolutely full of news about
> health concerns. On the other hand, what do you with a country where the
> doctors smoke as much as their patients? How are they expected to educate
> the population? Luckily, since the communist regime (sorry, but I did it
> purposely!) collapsed there came into being grassroot groups concerned about
> the environment and other matters, like smoking. A gentleman from Hungary in
> the name an environmental group published a sample letter in the Forum just
> yesterday asking us to write to the minister of environmental matters
> concerning cans versus bottles for beer and soft drinks. This is the kind of
> effort which couldn't exist before.
>
>         I am not at all surprised that the government's efforts had been
> useless. A government which was established in an illegitimate manner and
> which governed without the consent of the governed cannot be expected to be
> liked, obeyed, or listened to. That was the case in Hungary and it will take
> a long time before there will be a different relationship between the
> population and the government.
>
>         Eva Balogh
<<<<<<<<<<<
Eva brings out at least two good points.
1- The "new" government in the 1989-1993 timeframe failed miserably in
educating the people in terms of democracy, health, environment,
economics, et al.  They never met the people's expectation (false as that
may be) that it will be a simple "jump" to market economics (like
throwing a switch). Thus they fell on their ears (or butts) and lost the
people's vote.

2- The current government is just a slight color change (from old
communist to new social democrats(?)) [red to pink] and who really trusts
them?  The people wanted to "go back" to the good old days!!!!!

Unfortunately, there is no-one in Hungary that, in my opinion, can rally
the people to thinking as "one"
 so that the country can really move forward.

One needs that type of grass root movement and education to show why the
environment is critical to Hungary's (and adjacent countries') well being.
Peter Soltesz
+ - Re: AUTO Justice in Hungary (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 04:55 PM 11/30/96 GMT, Laszlo Balogh wrote:
>The
>Spot Fines are absolutely uncalled for and a corruptive.
>
>This year I went to Hungary twice. First in May than this month.
>
>Since I had to go Oroshaza both occasions I was stopped by the police on
>the E5 to Szeged. The first trip 3 times, twice going and once coming.
>Remember it's a relatively short trip!!
>
> While the last time I was stopped twice the same way and finally, once
>on the Budaorsi ut, the night before I left the country.
>
>It's obvious, that these type of activities must be changed on part of
>the police and On The Spot Fines must be stopped. When are they going to
>wake up?

        About two years ago we had a discussion about this spot checks in
Hungary. I brought up the subject because on the very first day after my
arrival in Hungary three years ago, my cousin's husband car, in which I was
riding, was stopped two minutes out of their street. Spotcheck. Two
policemen (actually one man and one woman) were standing idly on a small
square, waiting for their victims. The impression one gets is extremely
negative. Suddenly, old memories of the 1950s and 1960s creep back to one's
mind. Gee, one says, things haven't changed much, have they? Democracy or no
democracy the same kind of "police state" impression which one used to get
during the Kadar-regime. Honest to goodness, I have been living in Canada
and the United States for almost forty years and I wasn't stopped once by
the police without reason. Once I was stopped because I was going too fast,
and once because I was going too slowly. (The latter was a long time ago,
when I was a brand-new driver.) And, by the way, the police found that my
poor cousin had forgotten to have his car inspected and he immediately had
to pay 500 forints, on the spot. I don't know what would have happened if he
didn't have 500 forints on him.

        Eva Balogh

P.S. I just remembered that in the late 1960s and 1970s when the regime
encouraged tourism for financial reasons if you were driving a car with a
foreign license plate the police never bothered you with spot checks. I am
sure that they were told to spare them. I was driving with German and French
licence plates for three months every summer, driving all over the country
and not once was I stopped either in the cities or on the highways.
+ - Re: EE environment (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

According to Zoltan Rakonczay the "about same" amount of effort was
put into an anti-smoking campaign in Hungary as in the United States or in
Canada. But while in the States and in Canada smoking has diminished very
significantly in Hungary it didn't.

        There are two possibilities: either his assertion is correct or it
is not. Let's assume first that his claim is incorrect. Anything I see in
Hungary concerning smoking goes against Zoltan's claim. The price of
cigarettes are still relatively low: the most expensive pack of cigarettes
is about 70 cents, as opposed to about $2.00 in the United States. If I
recall the Canadian price is higher and new taxes will be added on tobacco
products in four or five provinces very soon. In addition to the relatively
low price of cigarettes there is still no comprehensive anti-smoking law in
the country as opposed to the United States and Canada where the federal
government, the state/provincial governments and local governments enacted
stringent anti-smoking laws. And finally, smoking is not depicted in Hungary
in a negative light. Let me give you examples from only one weekly magazine
which has lots of pictures: the 168 ora. Practically every issue contains
pictures of people smoking. And not just the people who are being
interviewed but also the pictures of the journalists which accompany the
articles. In a country which takes anti-smoking seriously you will not find
magazines depicting every second politician with a cigarette in hand,
including the prime minister.

        But, for the sake of argument, let's also assume that Zoltan is
correct. The Hungarian government did everything in its power to change the
attitude of the population toward smoking. Just like the United States and
Canada. And yet, the Hungarians, unlike the Americans and the Canadians,
failed to recognize the harmful effects of smoking. What kind of conclusion
can one draw in this case? I have been called all sorts of things, including
anti-Hungarian and therefore I will not utter the only conclusion one must
draw if Zoltan's claim is correct. I will leave that to the readers'
imagination.

        As for the grassroot organizations being "the strongest in the
eighties," and actually declined in the 1990s, again, I am skeptical.
Hungarian and foreign commentators repeatedly complain about the lack of
genuine civic society in a one-party regime which by definition would
include grassroot organizations of all sorts, from local chess clubs to
anti-smoking groups. In fact, because the population was discouraged from
establishing such organizations for political reasons, the population is no
longer accustomed to participate in the democratic process on the grassroot
level. It is enough to look around in today's Hungary to see that problem.
People, for example, complain about the the parliamentary members' shady
economic connections, but I haven't seen yet a grassroot organization which
would stand up and take a stand on the issue although I bet that a well
organized group of this sort could have a serious effect on the political
process, by declaring that they would support only candidates who renounce
all formal connection with business, be that of state or privately owned. I
think the politicians would think twice if their parliamentary seats were at
stake.

        Eva Balogh
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 11:24 AM 12/2/96 GMT, George Antony wrote:

>The Boeing 737 was in the stage of getting tatty: frayed edges on the
>seat covers, shadows on the luggage lockers where people touch them.
>Service was without a smile by burly stewardesses.  Lunch was a haphazard
>collection of Hungarian processed cheese wedges and dried-out white buns,
>cold meats and plenty of very poor quality Hungarian wine - the worst
>way to create interest in Hungarian viticulture.

        I flew Malev from New York to Budapest. The crew was half Hungarian,
half American. I happened to have an American stewardess who took a great
liking to a travelling salesman (an American with tons of samples of his
ware), sitting not very far from me. The plane was almost empty but because
my stewardess took a shine to this guy it was almost impossible to get
service. She was far too engrossed! The food was not very good: I was
offered: "chicken or beef,"  and in turn I asked what kind of chicken and
what kind of beef. The sweetheart of a stewardess answered firmly: "chicken
or beef." I picked beef and I still don't know what kind of beef it was but
considering that I was exceedingly hungry because I missed dinner on the
ground I gobbled up the whole thing. Otherwise the flight was uneventful
with a tear-jerker of an American film which could be listened to either in
Hungarian or in English.

>The best thing about flying MALEV to Budapest is that one arrives at
>the new terminal and does not have to endure the quaint 1960s conditions
>at the old one.

        Oh, yeah? Our MALEV from New York landed at the old terminal and we
also left from the old terminal.

        Interestingly enough the food was even worse on the way back. The
steward was a Hungarian. A jolly fellow who did his best at convincing me to
try Hungarian beer instead of the German or Dutch I was inclined to take.
The advice was not the best.

        Eva Balogh
+ - Re: AUTO Justice in Hungary (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Mon, 2 Dec 1996, Eva S. Balogh wrote:
<snip>
>
> P.S. I just remembered that in the late 1960s and 1970s when the regime
> encouraged tourism for financial reasons if you were driving a car with a
> foreign license plate the police never bothered you with spot checks. I am
> sure that they were told to spare them. I was driving with German and French
> licence plates for three months every summer, driving all over the country
> and not once was I stopped either in the cities or on the highways.
>
<<<< Now it seems that not only did the price of the tickets go up, but
they are looking for foreign cars (plates) and expensive cars first to
ticket or two away! The last ticket I have seen given out in HU was for
2000 HUF on the spot for going 50km in a 40 km zone...so was everyone
lese, but we had a A on the plate (Austrian).

I remember my friend was pulled over randomly in a LADA and they examined
his car for everything.....being that I spoke up in English & Hungarians
asking generic questions: Like is this normal to be stopped still??? etc.
They said that everything was in order...cost us 10 minutes of delay.
Peter
+ - Re: EE environment (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Eva and Zoltan's discussion on smoking....
Rather thamn rehash the whole thing. I agree that there is little being
done in HU regarding smoking. There is NO such thing as a smoke free
restaurant that I have found nor been to! People light up in meetings
like it is the norm -- they rarely open the windows in the winter (it is
cold!) so you have to breathe the air full of smoke. There is even a
relatively low cost (I think USA made Camel/Winston/Marlboro equiv.) that
sells for 50 to 100 ft (anyway only about 50 cents US).

They have a long way to go before restaurants and public places have
no-smoking sections!
Peter
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Mon, 2 Dec 1996, Eva S. Balogh wrote:
<SNIP>
> >The best thing about flying MALEV to Budapest is that one arrives at
> >the new terminal and does not have to endure the quaint 1960s conditions
> >at the old one.
>
>         Oh, yeah? Our MALEV from New York landed at the old terminal and we
> also left from the old terminal.


<<<< I concur with Eva...it does land and terminate at Terminal#1 (closer
in by 2 km to Budapest)

>         Interestingly enough the food was even worse on the way back. The
> steward was a Hungarian. A jolly fellow who did his best at convincing me to
> try Hungarian beer instead of the German or Dutch I was inclined to take.
> The advice was not the best.
>
Yes, Hungarian beer also went down in quality...it is better to get
"imports" even if they are bottled in HU.

BTW...Someone may have mentioned this already but please stay away form
the mafia taxi cabs at the airport. The last time someone took a cab it
cost them close to 5000 Forints while the airpoirt bus -- which takes you
anywhere in BP, including a residence, normally hotels for about 600 or
700 forints.
Peter Soltesz
+ - Re: Help!please translate this document! (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

>From the Directorate of the Roman Chatolic Elementary School:
Here we certify that Sandore Yerabek who was born in Szerednye
town/village in Ung county has finished the 5-th class of this school by
the following certificate:

I don't know where it is. Ung might be in Ukraine now, around Ungvar
town.

More comments see below


Kind Regards,

 Nandor BALOGH

EMails: 
        

On Mon, 2 Dec 1996  wrote:

> I've been told this is my grandfather's report card from 1895-96, but
> noone in the family can translate it. The top line reads: A szerednyei
> rom. kath. elemi nepiskola igazgatosagatol.  Incription reads:  Yerabek
> Sandor ung megyei szerednyei szuletesu, 11. even -error again.
probably 11.eves -means 11 years old

, rom. kath. valla -he was roman catholic  (can't
> read) tanulo as 1895-96 tanevben (can't read) rom. kath. elemi nepiskola
> Vin -that is aspelling error /it might be V-ik meaning 5 -th year of
that school/

osztalyat bevegezven, kovetkezo bizonyitvanyt nyert.
>
 Of course there's more. Can you help me out. I'd like to find this town
> and go visit
>   This is for my wife. Please reply to 
>
+ - Re: Nadia Comaneci / Kemenes Ilona (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

She left Romania through Hungary before the bigger political changes
there /disident with Hungarian help and with her possible husband/. Then
she became a successfull sport trainer and enterprener in the US. Then
/after the changes she returned back to Romania /temporal visit/ where
she was nicely welcomed /mostly because of business reasons/.

That's what I remember if I don't mix her with somebody.

Nandor BALOGH


On Sun, 1 Dec 1996, aheringer wrote:

> In article >,  says...
> >
> >Olvastam, hogy Nadia Comaneci (Kemenes Ilona) egy magyar apja van
> >(Gheorgie Comaneci - Kemenes Gyvrgy) is ezirt Ilona egy filszarmasz
> >magyar. De azt nem hittem... Nadia Comaneci (fil)-magyar szarmasz
> >ember-e? Rigen hallottam ezt. Mig nem biztos vagyok.
> >
> >Peter Chong
> >
> >Ui. Mi tvrtint Ilonaval 1980 utan? Kmvancsi vagyok...
> >
> >
> >I thought her name is Anna, not Ilona, but I may be wrong.  I don't know
> wht happened to her after 1980..  When she was here during the olympics,
> she spent a few days in the Laurentians in the same camp as my daughter.
>
> Agnes
>
+ - Re: To the debate of Joe and Johanne (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

E.Durant wrote:

>> So if the majority of the hungarian gypsies don't have a regular job and
>> earn their money either with illegal activities or through the wellfare
>> system, am I stereotyping if I conclude they don't like to work (or worse,
>> they are lasy). If I am, why?
>>
>> J.Zs
>>
>
>You are not just stereotyping, but spreading a malicious lie.
>A large portion of gipsies are unemployed, but the majority
>are earning their money like the rest of the population.
>The larger than average sized unemployment is due to
>the unskilled/low educational situation. This is due to
>inefficient resourses allocated to education at the poorest
>areas where gipsy communities are/were concentrated
>and residual racism/discrimination/prejudice of the past and the present
>regimes.
>A pattern of marginalised communites  like aboriginals(Australia)/indians(US)
>follows; alcoholism, short life expectency patterns, etc.


Nice job, Eva, however a little bit primitive. If I were you I would have
skipped the 'So if' at the bigenning, too. You could have done it as you had
the freedom where to begin the citation and without 'so if' the meaning
would have been more shocking. Of course the two other disturbing 'if'-s
had to remain as you cannot directly edit my posts.

But, thanks for the lesson, Eva. Next time when I try to be sarcastic
I will use 'one' or 'someone' instead of 'I' which would make your dirty
trick impossible. Also, I will try to use less sensible topic.

J.Zs
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Julie wrote:

>         Malev is as good an airline as any of the other
>         major carriers regarding comfort, timeliness,
>         service, security -- my only negative thought is
>         I dislike supporting a government that parades
>         the same old faces with different titles.....

You are behind the times.  MALEV has been sold to Alitalia, at least partly,
years ago.  So, you are 'supporting' the government of the day in Rome by
flying MALEV, not the one in Budapest.

George Antony
+ - Re: Nadia Comaneci / Kemenes Ilona (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 05:14 PM 12/2/96 +0000, Nandor Balogh wrote:
>She left Romania through Hungary before the bigger political changes
>there /disident with Hungarian help and with her possible husband/. Then
>she became a successfull sport trainer and enterprener in the US. Then
>/after the changes she returned back to Romania /temporal visit/ where
>she was nicely welcomed /mostly because of business reasons/.
>
>That's what I remember if I don't mix her with somebody.

        I think the above is pretty accurate. However, there was a guy with
her who turned out to be a rather unsavory character. I don't remember all
the details but they settled in Florida and the idol of gymnastics'
reputation was fairly low. However, I remember of reading something that she
got herself together, got rid of the fellow, and is doing fine.

        Eva Balogh
+ - Re: EE environment (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Eva Balogh wrote:

>        There are two possibilities: either his assertion is correct or it
> is not. Let's assume first that his claim is incorrect. Anything I see in
> Hungary concerning smoking goes against Zoltan's claim.

"Anything you see...". You ignored my remarks about the total ban on
tobacco ads. Maybe the government's campaign against smoking was not as
vigorous as it is in the US, but much of the anti-smoking effort in the
US goes into alleviating the effects of the lavish ad campaigns.
May I mention that it is mostly the American tobacco companies that
set up those nasty giant posters all over Hungary? Not that it reduces
the responsibility of the Hungarian government, but the US tobacco
industry has more than enough influence on the US Government, and it
would not be far from the truth to assert that they could buy Hungary
as is. (BTW, I don't think that the ban on advertising has been lifted.
Could somebody bring us up to date?)

There is still a considerable excise tax on tobacco, just as there is on
alcohol and coffee, and we consume excessive amounts of all. Regulations
concerning alcohol are just as strict as in the US (OK, the drinking
age is lower, but zero alcohol is allowed in the blood when driving),
but people still drink, even in the workplace. I used to work in an
office where out of the 14 employees I was the only non-smoker (so was
the janitor, but she was part-time:-) All the name-days were celebrated
in the director's office, and involved alcohol (not beer). All of it
was against the regulations, and everyboy knew that. But then again,
the company maintained two bank accounts, although businesses are allowed
only one. Let's not mention the various accounting procedures used
to pay people without having to pay the social secuirty tax.

Over the 17 years I spent in Hungarian schools, I never knew
anybody using drugs. In elementary school some kids
fooled around with a kind of glue, but not in my class. Hemp has
always been legally grown in the country, and we learned that it
was an excellent fiber plant, but it wasn't until I came to the US
at age 25 that I learned that it could also be used for recreational
purposes. I heard that drug use is now becoming a problem, but
I'm talkig about those good old Communist years, you know:-).
Are we justified to conclude that the non-existing Hungarian
anti-drug propaganda in the 70's was infinitely more efficient
than the multi-million (billion?) dollar US campaign? Why?

Eva, if you choose to ignore that we are talking about Hungary, and
not just another one of the United States, feel free to do so.
I am not the first one on this list to conclude that you know
everything better and it is not my mission to convince you about
anything. I had the good (or bad?) fortune of growing up in Hungary
and I do know the place quite well. I consider myself rather well
versed in environmental issues, that being my profession. You made
some comments about Hungary (and her environment) which were not
only inaccurate, but also grossly misleading and I felt obliged to
publicly correct them. I think I have made my point clear and I
am not going to argue about the matter any longer.

> The price of
> cigarettes are still relatively low: the most expensive pack of cigarettes
> is about 70 cents, as opposed to about $2.00 in the United States. If I
May I point out that the 70 cents is more expensive for a Hungarian
than the $2 is for you? I would have never known the price of tobacco
either in Hungary or in the US. Eva, do you happen to be a smoker?
(And if so, why?)

Zoltan Rakonczay
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

> > George Antony wrote:
> > >The best thing about flying MALEV to Budapest is that one arrives at
> > >the new terminal and does not have to endure the quaint 1960s conditions
> > >at the old one.

> On Mon, 2 Dec 1996, Eva S. Balogh wrote:
> >         Oh, yeah? Our MALEV from New York landed at the old terminal and we
> > also left from the old terminal.

Peter Soltesz wrote:
> <<<< I concur with Eva...it does land and terminate at Terminal#1 (closer
> in by 2 km to Budapest)

You seem to have been unlucky.  The fact remains that the home base for
MALEV is Terminal 2, while other airlines are expected to use Terminal 1
(the old one).  Perhaps as a code-sharing flight with Delta, your flights
were considered 'foreign'.

> Yes, Hungarian beer also went down in quality...it is better to get
> "imports" even if they are bottled in HU.

This is nonsense.  Since the return of the Dreher brand, Hungarian beer
has improved in quality and consistency.  Even the pedestrian Kobanyai
Vilagos is better nowadays.

Besides, the most common foreign brands are not merely bottled in Hungary
but also brewed there under licence.

George Antony
+ - Re: Help!please translate this document! (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 10:04 PM 12/1/96,  wrote:
>I've been told this is my grandfather's report card from 1895-96, but
>noone in the family can translate it. The top line reads: A szerednyei
>rom. kath. elemi nepiskola igazgatosagatol.  Incription reads:  Yerabek
>Sandor ung megyei szerednyei szuletesu, 11. even, rom. kath. valla  (can't
>read) tanulo as 1895-96 tanevben (can't read) rom. kath. elemi nepiskola
>Vin osztalyat bevegezven, kovetkezo bizonyitvanyt nyert.
>Of course there's more. Can you help me out. I'd like to find this town
>and go visit
>  This is for my wife. Please reply to 

Sandor Yerabek, who was born in the village of Szerednye in Ung County,
being eleven years old and Roman Catholic, in the academic year of 1895-96
completed the sixth grade of the public elementary school obtained the
following report card:
+ - Re: EE environment (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Zoltan Rakonczay is not a good sport, but by insisting that I am
wrong and he is right he just admitted that Hungarians are a very stupid lot
because after all the excellent anti-smoking propaganda of the Hungarian
government (equal to the Canadian or American), Hungarians kept smoking
while the Canadians and Americans figured out that it was harmful to their
health.

>"Anything you see...". You ignored my remarks about the total ban on
>tobacco ads. Maybe the government's campaign against smoking was not as
>vigorous as it is in the US, but much of the anti-smoking effort in the
>US goes into alleviating the effects of the lavish ad campaigns.

        The fact is that at the beginning of the American anti-smoking
campaign almost half the adult population smoked in this country while
twenty years later only about 23 percent. So, it was effective. As far as I
know the statistics on Hungarian smokers haven't changed a bit, and if it
did it wasn't for the better.

>May I mention that it is mostly the American tobacco companies that
>set up those nasty giant posters all over Hungary?

        And why do you think that the American tobacco companies rushed over
to Eastern Europe first thing and bought up all the cigarette manufacturing
companies? Because they felt sorry for the poor, downtrodden East Europeans?
Oh, no! Because they knew that they had an excellent market over there while
here the market was shrinking.

>Not that it reduces
>the responsibility of the Hungarian government, but the US tobacco
>industry has more than enough influence on the US Government, and it
>would not be far from the truth to assert that they could buy Hungary
>as is.

        The influence of the American tobacco companies have less and less
influence on Washington, but I am sure that they will do their utmost to
influence the Hungarian lawmakers in the coming debate on anti-smoking
legislation.

>(BTW, I don't think that the ban on advertising has been lifted.
>Could somebody bring us up to date?)

        No, it hasn't been lifted but, as with many other things, it is not
enforced.

>There is still a considerable excise tax on tobacco, just as there is on
>alcohol and coffee, and we consume excessive amounts of all. Regulations
>concerning alcohol are just as strict as in the US (OK, the drinking
>age is lower, but zero alcohol is allowed in the blood when driving),
>but people still drink, even in the workplace. I used to work in an
>office where out of the 14 employees I was the only non-smoker (so was
>the janitor, but she was part-time:-) All the name-days were celebrated
>in the director's office, and involved alcohol (not beer). All of it
>was against the regulations, and everyboy knew that. But then again,
>the company maintained two bank accounts, although businesses are allowed
>only one. Let's not mention the various accounting procedures used
>to pay people without having to pay the social secuirty tax.

        So, what are you saying that there is no work moral or any other
morals in Hungary?

>Over the 17 years I spent in Hungarian schools, I never knew
>anybody using drugs. In elementary school some kids
>fooled around with a kind of glue, but not in my class. Hemp has
>always been legally grown in the country, and we learned that it
>was an excellent fiber plant, but it wasn't until I came to the US
>at age 25 that I learned that it could also be used for recreational
>purposes. I heard that drug use is now becoming a problem, but
>I'm talkig about those good old Communist years, you know:-).

        You are changing the subject. What are you saying? I guess something
like that: "You are all upset about smoking and drinking but at least we
didn't have any drug problems, so we have had it over you." First of all,
Hungary does have a drug problem today and your joking about the "good old
Communist years," I am afraid, doesn't strike me as a joke. It sounds hollow.

>Are we justified to conclude that the non-existing Hungarian
>anti-drug propaganda in the 70's was infinitely more efficient
>than the multi-million (billion?) dollar US campaign? Why?

        Hungary was still more or less isolated from the rest of the world
in those days. Today it isn't. I just read yesterday in the New York Times
that while in the United States the number of the HIV-affected people is
decreasing, Eastern Europe today can boast of the fastest growing HIV
infection in the whole world.

>I am not the first one on this list to conclude that you know
>everything better and it is not my mission to convince you about
>anything.

        I don't know everything best, but I certainly have it over you when
it comes to logic.

>I had the good (or bad?) fortune of growing up in Hungary
>and I do know the place quite well.

        So, did I. But I did a few more things in addition. Among other
things I studied Hungarian history for years and years. And, in the last
three years I have followed Hungarian politics very closely.

>I consider myself rather well
>versed in environmental issues, that being my profession. You made
>some comments about Hungary (and her environment) which were not
>only inaccurate, but also grossly misleading and I felt obliged to
>publicly correct them. I think I have made my point clear and I
>am not going to argue about the matter any longer.

        You made yourself perfectly clear. Instead, I suggest that you write
a letter to the New York Times and explain to them that their reporting on
environmental issues in Eastern Europe is totally false.

>> The price of
>> cigarettes are still relatively low: the most expensive pack of cigarettes
>> is about 70 cents, as opposed to about $2.00 in the United States. If I
>May I point out that the 70 cents is more expensive for a Hungarian
>than the $2 is for you?

        (1) Obviously not expensive enough to consider quitting. (2) An
awful lot of items in the stores are as expensive if not more expensive than
in the United States. Therefore, *in comparison* I still find the price of
cigarette low.

>I would have never known the price of tobacco
>either in Hungary or in the US.

        Well, obviously, you are not concerned about the matter. I am. You
should be concerned, considering the death rate in Hungary!!

>Eva, do you happen to be a smoker?

        Surprise, surprise! I am not. I used to be until about ten years ago
when I quit as a result of the "I-don't-know-how-many-billion dollar"
campaign. You see, eventually the message struck home! Leesett a tantusz, as
the Hungarian slang expression goes.

>(And if so, why?)

        The above just shows that you have some preconcieved notions about
your opponents.

        Eva Balogh
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Tue, 3 Dec 1996, George Antony wrote:
<SNIP>
>
> > On Mon, 2 Dec 1996, Eva S. Balogh wrote:
> > >         Oh, yeah? Our MALEV from New York landed at the old terminal and
 we
> > > also left from the old terminal.
>
> Peter Soltesz wrote:
> > <<<< I concur with Eva...it does land and terminate at Terminal#1 (closer
> > in by 2 km to Budapest)
>
> You seem to have been unlucky.  The fact remains that the home base for
> MALEV is Terminal 2, while other airlines are expected to use Terminal 1
> (the old one).  Perhaps as a code-sharing flight with Delta, your flights
> were considered 'foreign'.

<<<< George you may be right on that one. I do recall arriving into
terminal #2 on Malev when I arrived from some European originating flights.
>
> > Yes, Hungarian beer also went down in quality...it is better to get
> > "imports" even if they are bottled in HU.
>
> This is nonsense.  Since the return of the Dreher brand, Hungarian beer
> has improved in quality and consistency.  Even the pedestrian Kobanyai
> Vilagos is better nowadays.
<<<< I do not agree. Only lately has Dreher been acceptable. Kobanyai,
once the average Joe's beer in HU is rather poor now. Perhaps our taste buds
have been overwhelmed with much better beers.

> Besides, the most common foreign brands are not merely bottled in Hungary
> but also brewed there under licence.
<<< Some are indeed, yet they do not seem to be as good as the original
for some reason. Perhaps it is the hops, water, etc.????
Peter Soltesz
+ - Re: To the debate of Joe and Johanne (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 03:47 PM 12/2/96 -0500, Janos Zsargo, responding to Eva Durant, wrote:

<snip>
>But, thanks for the lesson, Eva. Next time when I try to be sarcastic
>I will use 'one' or 'someone' instead of 'I' which would make your dirty
>trick impossible. Also, I will try to use less sensible topic.
                         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I'm afraid that's the only way Janos Zsargo will understand the topic.

Joe Szalai
+ - Hungarian beer (was: MALEV) (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

> > Peter Soltesz wrote:
> > > Yes, Hungarian beer also went down in quality...it is better to get
> > > "imports" even if they are bottled in HU.
>George Antony wrote:
> > This is nonsense.  Since the return of the Dreher brand, Hungarian beer
> > has improved in quality and consistency.  Even the pedestrian Kobanyai
> > Vilagos is better nowadays.

Peter Soltesz wrote:
> <<<< I do not agree. Only lately has Dreher been acceptable. Kobanyai,
> once the average Joe's beer in HU is rather poor now.

Perhaps we should call for a vote on that.

> Perhaps our taste buds
> have been overwhelmed with much better beers.

Mine certainly were not.  Australian beer has body but no taste, and the
mainstream US beers I tasted did not even have body let alone taste.

My yardstick has always been the Czech Pilseners, and now even Dreher
brew a reasonable imitation of that.  The Czech beers were one of the few
products that did not suffer in quality under communism, and they are still
available in Hungary for comparative tastings.

If anything, my gripe with the Hungarian beer scene is that most of the
premium beers nowadays are the relatively tasteless German/Austrian brands.
But then, who pays the fiddler calls the tune.

> > Besides, the most common foreign brands are not merely bottled in Hungary
> > but also brewed there under licence.

> <<< Some are indeed, yet they do not seem to be as good as the original
> for some reason. Perhaps it is the hops, water, etc.????

Malt is not difficult to prepare one way or another and special hops can
be imported.  Water IS critical, though, and can make a difference.


George Antony
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

>I have flown on Malev several times from London to Budapest using an old
>Russian built Ilushin ? (Boeing 727 copy). The flight was OK although it

It must be rather a Tupolev Tu-154. Malev didn't have Ilushin jets (IL-86),
but IL-18, which was a turboprop plane, used mainly for shorter flights (I
have flown IL-18 at least 15 times from Budapest to Warsaw, it was a polish
LOT plane, there were a case when the airplane was more than 10 years older
than me - I was about 20).

>left late (the Captain and a pretty stewardess were arriving late from
>their shopping -- last minute duty free ya know!)..  When it left London

I wonder if the plane was late because of the crew. They have to board
before the passangers:) A "before-take-off-checklist" for Tu-154 was about
half an hour:( And they can't start it without the Captain - it needs 3
people: Captain, Pilot, Engineer. It was not a fun to start a Tu.

>the pilot liked to demonstrate the performance features of the aircraft,
>right around lunch time. BTW lunch and service was good! Airplane noisy.

This is simply Murphy's law: when the coffee is served, some turbulence
appears:)

>Several times I flew from New York to Budapest on their new Boeing 767
>non-stop.
>Service on the Hungarian section needs improvement (this is a Delta/Malev
>joint flight).  Pilot was better this time -- I guess they learned how to
>operate a commercial plane by now!.

You mean that Hungarians living in Hungary are mainly dumbs, only those who
left they homeland are good ones? Don't be silly!

>Food OK by international standards. Service was acceptable by the same
>standards --- a ways to go before it meets Singapore Airlines or other
>top airlines service levels.
>
>Hope that this helps.
>Peter Soltesz
>
+ - Re: EE environment (fka HAPPY THANKSGIVING) (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

>On Sun, 1 Dec 1996, Zoltan Rakonczay wrote:
><SNIP>
>
>While Zoltan I agree with some of the things that you have said, let me
>suggest the following:
>
>If you go to Budapest during the winter you will see the evidence of the
>air pollution on the cars or any morning on the ground. The muck on the
>cars and the streets is dark, gooey, and sticky usually about 1/8 of an
>inch thick or more!
>
>Hungary still has not abandonded the 2 stroke engines in cars (Wartburgs,
>Trabant, etc.) nor has it forbidden the outright use of coal for heating
>(poor quality coal). Therefore one can practically choke in places like
>Budapest and almost die in Miskolc from the thick visible pollution.

It's because some people can't afford buying Mercedese or BMW or even Lada.

>The effluents into the Danube river from both outside and domestic
>sources are way exceeding any known standards.  Hungary has a Loooong way
>to go to clean up its act.  I do not ever remember being in such poor air
>pollution even in LA (perhaps at rare times) that one can see in some
>major cities in Hungary during the winter.

I wonder what cities you mean. Of course, there are places, where the air is
very polluted (manly where big factories, coal power plants are near the
city). One of them is surely Miskolc, and the second one is Budapest (nat
all the city, but big parts). Other major cities are not worse than average
(e.g your LA).

>Hungarians (to the gov't) were offered special taxis to BP to enable them
>to be recycled after two years of use as an exchange to anyone owning a
>Trabant and other 2 stoke engines. This was denied -- it would have
>rapidly exterminated the Trabants, et al while reducing the air pollution.
>Why one might ask??? In my opinion they were too greedy to accept a good
>deal.

Not really. Trabant owners were offered about 200.000 Ft for their cars. But
a new car, even a Suzuki Swift was about 1.000.000 Ft that time. It was not
such a good deal. For 200.000 forints you could buy only a very old used
western car (abou 10-15 years old) which is almost as environment-foely (see
your next sentence) as a 2-5 years old Trabant:) And has much more
mechanical problems. And spare parts are almost 10-times more expensive.

  The main air pollution comes from cars -- see USA et al....
>the cars today have 10% of the pollution of 10 years ago (roughly) we do
>have better air.
>Peter Soltesz

I am sure one can find a city in US, where the situation is at least as bad
as in Miskolc.

L. Monoki
+ - Re: Inquiry on MALEV (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

>Except on <http://www.travelfirst.com>;, do you know any homepage about
>MALEV on the net' ?

Try to find it on Yahoo or AltaVista.
(http://www.yahoo.com  and  http://altavista.digital.com)

L. Monoki

AGYKONTROLL ALLAT AUTO AZSIA BUDAPEST CODER DOSZ FELVIDEK FILM FILOZOFIA FORUM GURU HANG HIPHOP HIRDETES HIRMONDO HIXDVD HUDOM HUNGARY JATEK KEP KONYHA KONYV KORNYESZ KUKKER KULTURA LINUX MAGELLAN MAHAL MOBIL MOKA MOZAIK NARANCS NARANCS1 NY NYELV OTTHON OTTHONKA PARA RANDI REJTVENY SCM SPORT SZABAD SZALON TANC TIPP TUDOMANY UK UTAZAS UTLEVEL VITA WEBMESTER WINDOWS