Hollosi Information eXchange /HIX/
Copyright (C) HIX
Új cikk beküldése (a cikk tartalma az író felelőssége)
Megrendelés Lemondás
1 Best H. wordprocessor? (mind)  5 sor     (cikkei)
2 Re: The Honest Sovok Tereshenko (was Re: Kyiv St (mind)  13 sor     (cikkei)
3 Re: Best H. wordprocessor? (mind)  12 sor     (cikkei)
4 Re: The Honest Sovok Tereshenko (was Re: Kyiv St (mind)  27 sor     (cikkei)
5 Re: A different story about the war in Yugoslavia (mind)  28 sor     (cikkei)
6 Mr. Frajkor, listowner of Slovak-L (mind)  29 sor     (cikkei)
7 A different story about the war in Yugoslavia (mind)  283 sor     (cikkei)
8 Re: Romanian origins (mind)  16 sor     (cikkei)
9 Re: A different story about the war in Yugoslavia (mind)  10 sor     (cikkei)
10 Re: Romanian origins (mind)  25 sor     (cikkei)
11 Re: Another Example of Slovak Intolerance (mind)  50 sor     (cikkei)
12 Re: Another example of Slovak intolerance (mind)  19 sor     (cikkei)
13 Re:Romanian origins (mind)  37 sor     (cikkei)
14 Re: Need some help (mind)  9 sor     (cikkei)
15 Re: Romanian Origins (mind)  41 sor     (cikkei)
16 Re: Romanian origins (mind)  46 sor     (cikkei)
17 Re: SCM: Re: Romanian origins (mind)  51 sor     (cikkei)

+ - Best H. wordprocessor? (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

I'm looking for a hungarian wordprocessor with good spelling abilities.
I have Word 2 but it doesn't do a good job. Specially with the accents.
		"Csak egy hobo vagyok egy viragcserepben"
+ - Re: The Honest Sovok Tereshenko (was Re: Kyiv St (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

[followups set to alt.flame]

In article >,  (alex) wrote:

another anti-Russian masterpiece....


Alex is trolling. Please do not respond.

Henrietta Thomas
Chicago, Illinois

+ - Re: Best H. wordprocessor? (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >,
leslie howard > wrote:
| I'm looking for a hungarian wordprocessor with good spelling abilities.
| I have Word 2 but it doesn't do a good job. Specially with the accents.
| Thanks
| --
| 		"Csak egy hobo vagyok egy viragcserepben"

Do you have Hungarian word 2? DO youhave the keyboard
drivers and the Hungarian font set?

+ - Re: The Honest Sovok Tereshenko (was Re: Kyiv St (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >,  says...
>[followups set to alt.flame]
>In article >,  (alex) wrote:
>another anti-Russian masterpiece....
>Alex is trolling. Please do not respond.

Sovok Henrietta Thomas is sucking. She removed her false teeth to facilitate th
Please do not respond.


[followups restored]

>Henrietta Thomas
>Chicago, Illinois

+ - Re: A different story about the war in Yugoslavia (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

"Aleksandar Sarovic" 
argues the reason for Yougolavian Breakup

He is wrong in his long posting

Yugoslavia broke up because:

1. The same reason why Italy wants to break up. The control on the 
economy and the ratio of reinvestment in a certain area.

2. Incompatibility of identity: 
									afiliation to Western Civilization - Serbia and Motenegro
								 have nothing to do with it

							  national identity

						   religious identity, 

									cultural identity

 A. Albu
+ - Mr. Frajkor, listowner of Slovak-L (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Dear fellow Netizen,

In advance, I apologize for the crossposting but I think this 
issue may be of interest to this forum, too.

Slovak-L is a mailing list created by Mr. Frajkor himself to 
promote hatred, extreme nationalism and rehabilitation of the
Slovak fascism. Mr. Frajkor, a professional propagandist, is
routinely having recourse to various tricks from the lowest
arsenal of a bad journalist, such as purpose lies, falsifications
and other manipulations.

This weekend, I will address some recent defamatory allegations of 
Mr. Frajkor that will, as a side product, demonstrate his use of 
the abovementioned tools.

The articles will appear in Slovak-L only and will not be crossposted
in order to preserve bandwith and people's adrenaline. Mr. Frajkor 
already is an unwelcome person in a number of forums.

Slovak-L can be read either as a newsgroup 
or can be subscribed to by sending a message to
with an empty subject line and the body of the message as follows:
       SUBSCRIBE SLOVAK-L First_name Name.

Roman Kanala

+ - A different story about the war in Yugoslavia (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

A different story about the war in Yugoslavia

People in Yugoslavia used to live quite well before 1990. The living
standard was relatively high and relations between people from six
republics with their six nations and three religions were normally pretty
harmonious. The Serbo-Croat speakers in Yugoslavia belonged to the same
Slavonic group but were separated by a different history and by Catholic,
Orthodox and Muslim religion. Yugoslavia had a kind of a market economy
with over protected workers who often lived by the rule that they could
always work less than what they were paid for. The lack of responsibility
at all levels of work gradually destroyed the totality of all economical
relationships, together with Yugoslavia itself.

The last communist Prime Minister of Yugoslavia, Mr. Ante Markovic, tried
unsuccessfully to make reforms towards market economy and free
parliamentary elections. There were little interest in federal elections,
while the interest in local elections was huge. A majority of new
candidates in the republics demanded absolute control over their republics'
resources and blamed Yugoslavia for all discomforts of common living.
People's economical irresponsibility found its echo in political
irresponsibility when all republic elected nationalistic candidates. All
the new leaders in turn sabotaged federal Prime Minister's program which
could have eventually taken Yugoslavia into the EU.

The new presidents of the republics, except from Serbia and Montenegro, did
not hesitate to secede from Yugoslavia at any price. Serbian leaders didn't
want secession because Serbs lived as indigenous population in all republic
except Slovenia. The republics were created under control of president
Tito, ethnically Croat who might be afraid of the largest Serbian nation in
Yugoslavia so he divided them more than other nations. The results of
referendums in Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, and Macedonia
demonstrated that most people from those republics except Serbs wanted
sovereignty, while most Serbs (including those from Serbia and Montenegro)
wanted to stay in Yugoslavia. Soon after those referendums, leaders from
separatist republic stopped negotiating about the future of Yugoslavia.
Supported by the EU international arbitration commission, they proclaimed
independence from Yugoslavia, and moreover, that Yugoslavia did not exist
any more. This move ran against the right to self-determination of the
people who wanted to remain in Yugoslavia.

In the Summer of 1991, the Slovenian government unilaterally declared
sovereignty and cut all relationship with Yugoslavia. Because no deal was
made about Slovenia's separation, the Yugoslav Federal Army used power to
protect the territorial integrity of the country and was attacked by
Slovenian Territorial Defense forces. At that time a well organized
propaganda started all over the world with headlines such as: "Serbian
communist army attacked free Slovenian nation." The true situation was very
different. In those days, the President, the Prime Minister, and Minister
of foreign Affairs of Yugoslavia were ethnic Croats. The Yugoslav Federal
Army came from all ethnic groups, including Slovenians. The war lasted only
a few days, while the Federal Army had almost ten times higher casualties
than Slovenian forces because it did not have clear orders to fight in

In Croatia and Bosnia, the situation was more complex because of the large
local Serbian populations. The Serbs were one of the founding peoples under
the Constitutions of Croatia and Bosnia, and they did not want to separate
from Yugoslavia. Because of that , the new Croatian Parliament hurried up
in 1990 to take the constitutional right from the Serb people and redefine
them as a minority. After that, the Serbs proclaimed the parts of Croatia
where they had been living for centuries as a majority to be the Serb
Republic of Krajina. The Croatian government responded by importing weapons
from Hungary and attacking these ethnic Serb areas. The Krajina Serbs
formed their own territorial defense forces, got their weapons from the
Yugoslav Federal Army, and confronted the Croatian forces. The Croatian
Government blamed the Yugoslav Federal Army for aggression and lost of
territory, attacking its barracks in Croatia in order to get heavy weapons.
After that, the Yugoslav Federal Army really attacked Croatian forces which
ended in destruction of Vukovar and the siege of Dubrovnik.

Well organized international propaganda again blamed the Serbs. At that
time, the EU and the UN offered help to stop the war in Croatia. By the
Cyrus Vance plan, signed by the representatives from Yugoslavia, Croatia,
Krajina and UN, the Yugoslav Federal Army pulled out of Croatia, while Serb
held territories in Croatia were to be protected by the UN forces until the
problem would be solved through negotiations. In that plan, there was no
condition about the future of the Republic of Krajina, but later, under the
pressure from the US and Germany, a condition was included that it had to
remain part of Croatia, something the Serbs could not accept.

In January of 1992, Germany further undermined Yugoslavia by supporting
unilateral violent secessions and recognizing Slovenia and Croatia as
independent states. Other countries followed suit. Hence, the borders of
Yugoslavia were changed not peacefully, through mutual negotiations, as
required by international law, but by force and through international
support for unilateral secessions. In April of 1992, the US and  the EU
recognized Bosnia and Herzegovina as an independent state. It did not
matter that one third of the Bosnian population were Serbs who did not want
to secede from Yugoslavia, or that they were traditionally farmers who
owned almost two thirds of the Bosnian land. Finally, according to
international codes, Bosnian and Croatian governments did not fulfill the
required conditions for recognition, because they had no control over the
territories of those republics within the pre-war borders. In the
destruction of Yugoslavia international laws were used thus very
selectively, to say the least.

At the time when the US recognized Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croat and Muslim
solders and officers had already deserted from the Yugoslav Federal Army.
When the Serb people in Bosnia and Herzegovina formed their own army, they
took hold of most of the Federal Army's heavy weapons. Muslims and Croats
held most of the arms factories, however. After the international
recognition, the Muslim and Croat dominated government was encouraged to
rule over the whole of Bosnia and Herzegovina, which the Serbs could not
accept. This trigged off the war. Once again, well organized international
propaganda labeled the Serbs as aggressors.

Moreover, the US-led UN blamed Yugoslavia (Serbia and Montenegro) for the
war in Bosnia and called upon the Yugoslav government to stop it, or face
economic sanctions. At that time, Yugoslavia had no power to stop the war
any more because the Serbs in Bosnia created the Serb Republic and acted
very much on their own. It goes without saying that Yugoslavia could not
stop the Muslim and Croat army operations. After a massacre that happened
in Sarajevo when an explosion killed a number of people waiting for bread,
the UN imposed economic sanctions against Yugoslavia. Later on, the British
"Independent" found there were serious indications that the Muslims had
done it on purpose, to blame the Serbs. Some UNPROFOR soldiers from Britain
confirmed that many indications pointed at the Muslim army killing their
own people in order to accuse the Serbs and to involve NATO in the war on
their side.

The US-led UN passed many resolutions in favor of Muslims and other
Yugoslav ethnic groups against Serbs. They recognized all the separatist
republic, but not the present Yugoslavia. The Serbs of the former
Yugoslavia were the only people who were denied the right of
self-determination. Furthermore, the UN proclaimed six Muslim towns in
Bosnia as UN "safe areas" protected by the NATO air power. These areas were
supposed to be demilitarized, which in fact never happened. They were a
safe place for the Muslim army to prepare their attacks against the Serbs.
NATO attacked only the Serb army even though the Muslim and Croat forces
launched most of the attacks including a number of attacks on the UN
troops. Presently, the Bosnian army has twice as many soldiers as the
Bosnian Serbs. Croatia has a well equipped army, with whole arsenals of
weaponry brought in for the Muslim and Croat forces in contravention of the
arms embargo declared by the UN. The retired Croatian general Spegelj and
the former Prime minister of Bosnia and Herzegovina Silajdjic confessed
publicly that they had received weapons from Germany and Iran. Mr. Clinton,
the President of the US, recently confessed knowledge about that.
Therefore, call for the lifting of arms embargo from the Croats and Muslims
was a peace of propaganda.

Another piece of propaganda is the International Court in the Hague which
has investigated mostly Serb war crimes in the former Yugoslavia, even
though numerous well documented reports on Muslim and Croat war crimes do
exist. The result of this policy was enormous number of true and false
accusations against the Serbs in the media, but very few against Muslims
and Croats, The 50,000 Muslim women allegedly raped by the Serbs, were
found (by the UN expert Bassiouni) to be a few hundred on all sides in the
war and even that has not yet been proven. The Muslims and Croats also
abused Serb women and held Serb men and women in camps. That remains
unknown because the Serbs have been seldom invited to speak for themselves
before the UN and in world media. True, the Serbs are not kind hosts on
their territory either. An ethnic war includes ethnic cleansing an all
sides. It should be known that ethnic cleansing on large scale started in
Western Slavonia (Croatia) in 1991 and in Western Herzegovina in 1992 where
the Serbs were victims. Almost half of the Serb population was displaced in
Bosnia, and probably the same percentage of Muslims and Croats.

The UN Contact Group made its proposal to end the war in Bosnia calling
upon the Bosnian and Herzegovinian Serbs to take it or leave it. The main
problem was the UN insistence for Bosnia and Herzegovina to remain a
unified country. The Serbs did not accept this because their survival under
the Croat and Muslim chauvinist regimes is highly improbable. Besides, the
memory of a Croat-Muslim nazi genocide against the Serbs between 1941-1945,
when hundreds of thousands Serbs civilians were killed, stands against a
unitary state with their yesteryear's henchmen. After the Serb rejection of
the Contact Group plan, the UN representatives refused to talk to the
Bosnian and Herzegovinian Serb authorities. With no negotiations going on,
the war once again took a turn for the worse.

The preceding facts show there is little evidence of present Yugoslavian
responsibility for the war, yet Yugoslavia suffered under the economic
sanctions for four years. It is well known that the Croatian army was
fighting in Bosnia against Muslims and Serbs, with no economic or any other
sanctions. The US, in the manner of a colonial empire, underwrote the Croat
& Bosnian Confederation which "legalized" Croatia's military involvement in
the Bosnian war. The Serb people who were the main builders of Yugoslavia
after both World wars are not allowed to be united. Last year, the Croatian
army invaded the UN protected Serb territory in Western Slavonia, killed
hundreds of civilians, and carried out total ethnic cleansing of the Serbs
with no UN response. So this territory was not kept under the UN protection
until problem could be solved through negotiations, but until Croatia
succeeded in building an army in spite of the UN arms embargo. After that,
the UN lost credibility in the eyes of Serbs who than occupied two UN "safe
areas" in Bosnia from which the Muslims continuously attacked and killed
the Serb people in the villages nearby. The Croatian government declared
the Serb war success in Bosnia to be a "threat" to Croatia, attacked and
took two Serb towns in Bosnia.

In Croatia itself, the present government has allowed and supported
glorification of the country's nazi-fascist past. The WWII fascists,
responsible for genocide against the Serbs, Jews, Gypsies and other people
are back in Croatia today, some even in power. Although, a large number of
Croats fought against fascism during WWII, a large number of streets are
not called by their name any more, and thousands of their monuments were
destroyed all over Croatia. On the other hand, the street name of the Croat
fascist ideologist Budak appeared in the town of Split, and the name of the
new Croat currency is Kuna used in the nazi-fascist Croatia. Everyone who
has read the government-controlled Croatian newspaper or watched TV could
easily see that the Croatian government has built the unity of the Croat
people around its chauvinistic hatred of the Serbs. The Croatian president
Tudjman said publicly that he was happy because his wife is neither a Serb
or a Jew. The Croatian Minister of Defense Susak (a pizza salesman from
Toronto) raised his hand publicly in a fascist salute to greet his army. In
1991, a five members of his body guard executed the family Zec with their
fourteen year old daughter in the capital town of Croatia, Zagreb, only
because they were Serbs. The killers admitted everything before the
Croatian Court but were released because of alleged irregular court
procedure.("Globus", Zagreb). This trial probably did not have intention to
punish the killers but was a perfidious act which had to frighten the Serbs
to get away from Croatia. Moreover, the Croatian president Tudjman gave a
medal for the heroic act in war to Rimac who was one of the killers. The
leader of Croatian regular volunteer forces Mercep was suspected for
leading the execution of still not defined number of the Serb civilians in
the town Gospic before the war but the investigation never started. It is
not hard to imagine what happened later in the war. Everything I have
written is well known or could be easily verified but the World repeatedly
closed its eyes.

Because of that, last year the Croatian government mobilized 250,000 troops
to capture the territory of the Serb Republic of Krajina, allegedly
protected by the UN. With silent support of the US and Germany, the attack
started. In this moment NATO destroyed the Serb radar system what was
reported as a "mistake". The international community very concerned when
the Yugoslav Army started to crush the Croat armed insurrection in 1991,
was indifferent when the Serbs suffered the aggression. The Republic of
Krajina had incomparably less inhabitants than Croatia and was exhausted
after years of unjustified UN economic sanctions. The Yugoslav Army had
pulled out of Croatia in 1991 with the signed obligation for the UN and
Yugoslavia under the Vance plan to protect the Serbs in Krajina. Under the
subsequent pressure from the UN, Yugoslavia did not protect them and the
whole Serb population fled to Bosnia and Serbia. The UN failed to defend
its protected area from the Croat attack and helped to arrange the exodus
of the Serb people. In Croatia today remain probably less than ten percent
of the 600,000+ Serbs, 12% of Croatia's population before the war, who
lived there for centuries. This second Croat genocide against the Serb
population in this century, was supported by the World's most powerful
countries and the United Nations.

The UN involvement in Bosnia was similar. After the last massacre in
Sarajevo, the Serb government denied responsibility and called for a
independent investigation, but the UN representative quickly and
"precisely" accused the Serbs for doing this from the place near the battle
field. The Serb government did not have any motive. For the first time they
were offered with the right to make the confederation link to Yugoslavia
and they accepted negotiations. On the other hand, the Muslim government
took benefit from the massacre because it would stop an unpleasant
negotiation about future of Bosnia and NATO was definitely involved in the
war on their side by massive air strikes and rapid reaction forces. Later
on, ITAR-TASS informed that the chief of the UN staff in Sarajevo, colonel
Andrej Demurenko had made his own investigation about massacre and found
that the UN report was a forgery because the grenade could not be launched
from the reported position.

The war in Bosnia stopped after the agreement in Dayton where the Serbs got
49% of Bosnian territory. If it had happened earlier the war probably would
not started. The USA and Germany made a hefty contribution to the damage in
this region by their disastrous leadership of the UN and the EU. Their
contribution to the destruction of the former Yugoslavia created chaos.
Their continuos double standard policy encouraged one side and pressed
another, which extended the war and prolonged the suffering of the people.
The result of their policy in the former Yugoslavia was an ethnically pure
Croatia, a tragically split Bosnia and Herzegovina, multiethnic Serbia and
Montenegro under economic sanctions, and the war. This kind of policy could
also destroy the UN with unforseeable consequences.

I will not attempt to explain why the US and Germany have been doing this,
although one could guess about it. Let their leathers explain us why have
they taken their countries upon the road of support of the clearly neo-nazi
Croatian regime and the militant Muslim clique of Sarajevo. Until they do,
we should continue rising this question.

To solve the Yugoslav problem there is only one way to follow: all sides
have to be treated equally. If the UN and World's leaders want to interfere
in this conflict their position has to be neutral. They could exercise
strong economic and political pressure on ALL sides in the conflict to obey
the human right rules and to make a just agreement on all the future
relationships in the region. Any other kind of engagement has failed and
will fail again hurting all sides involved.

							Aleksandar Sarovic
+ - Re: Romanian origins (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Gyorgy Kovacs ) wrote:

: Christian, you list a lot of  assumptions, just because you don't agree with
: someone. That's quite immature also. Regardless of age.
: GK

Hi Gyorgy,

Well, I don't agree completely with you. It's true that I make assumptions,
but not because I don't agree with someone. I do it when I have some
elements that could suggest something.
And if you followed the thread you'll know by now that my assumptions
were correct.

Cristian Alb
+ - Re: A different story about the war in Yugoslavia (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >, A Albu  > wrote:
>"Aleksandar Sarovic" 
>argues the reason for Yougolavian Breakup
>He is wrong in his long posting

Yes, and so are you.
+ - Re: Romanian origins (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >,
Cours 6412 > wrote:
>Gyorgy Kovacs ) wrote:
>: Christian, you list a lot of  assumptions, just because you don't agree with
>: someone. That's quite immature also. Regardless of age.
>: GK
>Hi Gyorgy,
>Well, I don't agree completely with you. It's true that I make assumptions,
>but not because I don't agree with someone. I do it when I have some
>elements that could suggest something.
>And if you followed the thread you'll know by now that my assumptions
>were correct.
>Cristian Alb

If you re-read my sentence, I never argued if the assumptions were right or
wrong. (some of them were right some of them were wrong)
My statement is that you were just about as childish as ha was, in these 
No offence,
+ - Re: Another Example of Slovak Intolerance (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On Wed, 21 Aug 1996, HipCat wrote:

> [It is now ILLEGAL to speak Hungarian in public places - yes this at the
> dawn of the 21st century. This recent]
> >This is nonsense. You probably confuse public places with government
> offices. And even then it's still not true. As far as I remember the law
> was to ensure that a person speaking the official language (Slovak) will
> be able to communicate with government employees. If there is any "ban"
> it
> concerns only official documents, which makes a lot of sense. The law
> says
> nothing about verbal communication among Hungarian speaking persons,
> should it take place in an office, on a street or anywhere else.<
> Yes I meant official places, however this law sets a mood for the entire
> country.  Again I don't think you realize the seriousness nmor the
> effects of the law.

There is a Slovak saying whose literal translation is: 
"Hundred times nothing tired an ass to death."

At first there is one "small" inaccuracy (public instead of official), 
then another (subconscious overestepping the boundaries of the law);
no wonder if suddenly we find that the truth has evaporated somewhere.

If kids under 12 are not permitted to go to the movies after 8 pm, 
does this "set the mood" for their expulsion at 5:30?

> ["language purity law" even sought to ban the use of Hungarian in
> Church.  As ignorant as many of these Slovak lawmakers are, they took
> this part of the law out -  gee, thanks!]
> >Well, they are not ignorant enough to forget Cernova. 
> Your sarcasm is totally out of place.<
> What?  You are trying to justify the banning of Hungarian or any other
> language in Church?  Cool!

I expect your apology.

False accusations like this can make one believe that after all Slovak
government may have a point when it speaks about "distortion of our image"
and stuff like that. How can we get out of this deadlocked circle? This
comment of yours indicates a very fascist/communist type of thinking.
Somebody disagrees with you and immediately you are ready to make such
far-reaching conclusion about him. Why? Did anybody tell you that it was
an obvious thing to deduce? On what grounds? My guess is that you don't
know what I meant by Cernova. Feel free to ask.

Peter Hakel
+ - Re: Another example of Slovak intolerance (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

On 20 Aug 1996, Jan Hlavacek wrote:

> On 20 Aug 1996 05:12:19 GMT, Peter k Chong > wrote:
> >Dear Mr. Hakel


> >Sorry about bursting your bubble, but I must admit that some of your 
> >material was quite shocking for me (a Hungarophile) to read! 
> >
> I don't know which post are you talking about, but in general, Peter
> Hakel doesn't appear to me as a supporter of current slovak
> government. I just thing you are barking at a wrong tree here.  

It was not a post but a private mail.

Peter Hakel
+ - Re:Romanian origins (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >,  says...
Peter Chong wrote:
>........................................ Also, the Hungarians consider 
>themselves to be descendants of Hunnish and other so-called "barbarian" 
>conquerors. Of course in the West and the rest of the world we view them 
>as barbarian, but the Hungarians regard them with respect (notice the 
>number of boys and famous Hungarian men with the given name of "Attila"). 

I don't know any Hungarians who consider themselves to be descendants
of the Huns. The term *Hungarian* is a corruption (from Onogur) and it 
is a well known blunder to confuse the misnomer *Hungarian* with the 
Huns of that invaded Europe. The Huns as a people and empire broke up 
and disappeared from history circa 455 AD, Over a century later similar 
peoples (Huna, but it isn't proven that they're the same as the earlier 
Huns) attacked Iran and India. Many waves of different nomadic tribes 
on horseback went through the Dunatul Alfold around the time of the Dark 
Ages (not only the Huns) before the Magyars (along with various other 
smatterings of peoples) settled there.

The name Attila is a common Turkic name that more than likely took 
hold among Magyar speakers as a consquence of:
a) Turkic peoples that originally settled with the Magyars in the 
Dunatal Alfold 
b) later Ottoman influence, which was substantial. (Turkic languages 
and peoples spread far into middle Asia). The use of the name Attila 
in Hungary has nothing directly to do with Attila the Hun.

Anyone can propose speculative fantasies about Magyar origins, but I 
prefer more rigorous scholarship, or at least studies by people I know 
to have some worthy intellectual credentials; try Prof. George Cushing's 
*Finno-Ugrian Languages and Peoples* for starters.

George Szaszvari, DCPS Chess Club, 42 Alleyn Park, London SE21 7AA, UK
Planet Earth, Milky Way Galaxy * ARM Club * C=64..ICPUG * NW London CC
+ - Re: Need some help (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Val Eckertson > wrote:

>My grandmother was born in Hungary.  The only information I have is her 
>madien name was Csernak and I think her place of birth was Rakos Palotta 
>Pestmegye.  I've look on maps and can't find it.  Can anyone help me?

Rakospalota is a suburban part of metropolitan Budapest. You can
locate it on a complete map of Budapest
+ - Re: Romanian Origins (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Peter k Chong wrote:

> [...]
> With regards to my girlfriend, she is Hungarian. I originally wasn't this
> involved in Hungarian culture/affairs but being curious of her background
> I just did some reading of Hungarian history and culture. It was only
> after I ran across the Hungarian-Sumerian-Finno-Ugric and
> Hungarian-Romanian controversies that I really began getting myself
> involved. By now this was independant of her influence (sounds lame but
> true). This lead me to all sorts of questions regarding Hungarian history
> and I have found some supporters on and off the net along with the
> skeptics. (I guess it can be avoided) She just regards my
> obsession/idéefixe with amusement and really doesn't mind. Maybe I can
> sound chauvanistic here (you're not the first one to speak up) but I
> being young, raw, naive and sometimes downright stupid, I'm not too
> surprised.
> C'est la vie
> Regards
> Peter Chong

You forgot to add that you're also a schmuck.  I have never answered 
you because from the begining I suspected that your first message
was presumptious, that it was a big lie.  You have lied then and you
have never appologized for it.  Your posts are pseudo-scientific,
showing little understanding of the issues and more the unorganized
manner in which you have selected exclusively information that fits 
your bias.    
For these "qualities", your posts do not deserve to be answered and there
are few serious people that have decided to give you a second chance and
are attempting to engage in a dialogue with you.  All you're looking for 
is to provoque reactions and in my case you finally did.
This is the only time I am commenting on your posts, to let you know the
opinion of some of us who will not waste our time to dialogue with a dick.
It makes no sense to do it.

+ - Re: Romanian origins (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Gyorgy Kovacs ) wrote:
: In article >,
: Cours 6412 > wrote:
: >Gyorgy Kovacs ) wrote:
: >
: >: Christian, you list a lot of  assumptions, just because you don't agree wi
: >: someone. That's quite immature also. Regardless of age.
: >: GK
: >
: >Hi Gyorgy,
: >
: >Well, I don't agree completely with you. It's true that I make assumptions,
: >but not because I don't agree with someone. I do it when I have some
: >elements that could suggest something.
: >And if you followed the thread you'll know by now that my assumptions
: >were correct.
: >
: >Cristian Alb

: Hi,
: If you re-read my sentence, I never argued if the assumptions were right or
: wrong. (some of them were right some of them were wrong)
: My statement is that you were just about as childish as ha was, in these 
: assumptions.
: No offence,
: GK

I did and I think that you should also re-read them.

"Cristian you list assumptions, JUST because you don't agree.
 THAT is immature also".

Wich means : listing assumptions because not agreing is immature.

Another more contorted interpretation could be:

   listing assumptions is immature
   not agreing is immature.

This in the case where you interpret "THAT" as not referring to
the whole line but just to one (undefined) sentences.

Cristian Alb
+ - Re: SCM: Re: Romanian origins (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Gyorgy Kovacs wrote:
> In article >,
> Cours 6412 > wrote:
> >Peter k Chong ) wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >>On Romanian origins
> >>the Dacians are considered to be a Central Asian
> >>people similar to the Scythians - that is to say they were
> >>a horse-riding people. Perhaps the name Dacia is related to
> >>Turk? (But I somehow doubt that). Anyway, it is probable that
> >>the Dacians came into the modern Transylvanian/Wallachian
> >>area before the Christian Era.
> >
> >FYI Dacians belong to the Thracian family of peoples.
> >And they were indo-europeans as were the Greeks, the Romans, etc.
> >They came in Dacia around 2000 years before the Christian Era.
> >
> >
> >Excuse me, but how old are you ?
> >Are you in the 15-20 years old range ?
> >I am asking you that, because I find your behavior quite immature.
> >I noticed your postings on s.c.m. first on Hungarian history then
> >involving yourself in the "ancient" hungarian-slovak and
> >hungarian-romanian  verbal warfare.
> >Some time ago you were asking about information on Romanians
> >origin. Now you came back, and with great self confidence, you post
> >these nonsenses.
> >
> >I learned from your previous postings that you have an Hungarian
> >girl friend. That could explain your enthusiasm in "enrolling"
> >yourself on Hungarian "fronts". That is very "heroic". But won't
> >do it.
> >A little advice ? There is no need to thrive yourself in
> >appearing a "better Hungarian" in her eyes. Be yourself.
> >
> >With deep Chinese wisdom,
> >
> >Cristian Alb  ;-)
> Christian, you list a lot of  assumptions, just because you don't agree with
> someone. That's quite immature also. Regardless of age.
> GK
> ======= The following has been added by the mailer software =======
> subs/unsubs info - mailto:
> digest - mailto:
> please do not send me anymore mail!