Hollosi Information eXchange /HIX/
HIX HUNGARY 941
Copyright (C) HIX
1997-03-14
Új cikk beküldése (a cikk tartalma az író felelőssége)
Megrendelés Lemondás
1 Want a list of unpublished govt reports on Hungary (mind)  82 sor     (cikkei)
2 Re: Health Care and the GDP (mind)  18 sor     (cikkei)
3 Re: NATO Expansion (mind)  50 sor     (cikkei)
4 Re: NATO Expansion (mind)  35 sor     (cikkei)
5 HL-Action: Collective Human Rights (mind)  158 sor     (cikkei)
6 HL-Action: Collective Human Rights (mind)  158 sor     (cikkei)
7 Re: Anglo-Saxons (mind)  43 sor     (cikkei)
8 Re: NATO Expansion (mind)  33 sor     (cikkei)
9 Re: Health Care and the GDP (mind)  70 sor     (cikkei)
10 Re: NATO Expansion (mind)  35 sor     (cikkei)

+ - Want a list of unpublished govt reports on Hungary (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

DO YOU WANT A LIST OF REPORTS ON THE SUBJECT OF HUNGARY?

You can get a list of [largely unpublished] technical reports on Hungary
and related topics.  Many of these reports have been locked away for
various bureaucratic reasons and have not been put into the public
domain.

Here's how you can obtain a LIST of
several dozen technical reports on Hungary and related
subjects from the Defense Technical Information Center, a government
agency. [see below]

IMPORTANT NOTE:  Do not bother using the DTIC web site--for
comprehensive research purposes it is worthless because the web site
omits most of the two million technical reports in the DTIC collection.
[About half of those reports are NOT, repeat NOT, repeat NOT in the NTIS
collection, and have been unavailable to the public.]  If you want a
comprehensive and uncensored list, SEND A LETTER instead--you will get
much better results.

The fee is likely to cost you only a few bucks or might be free of
charge.  You will, however, want to include a statement in the letter
such as *I agree to pay reasonable fees associated with this request.
Please notify me if the cost will exceed $25.*.  The purpose of the
statement is so that they won't delay the processing of the request.
DTIC WILL try to dissuade you from asking for this list.  If they send
you a letter, and you do not respond with whatever additional
information they want, they will withdraw your request and you will not
get your information.  Please don't call DTIC unless you have a question
and you have absolutely have no other choice.

Here is a form letter to use for your request:

To:    Defense Technical Information Center
       Attn:  DTIC-RSM [Kelly D. Akers, FOIA Manager]
       8725 John J. Kingman Road, Suite 0944
       Fort Belvoir, VA  22060-6128  USA
Phone: 703-767-9194

Dear Ms. Akers:

I request the following records under the provisions of the Freedom of
Information Act:

A computer generated technical report bibliography of reports on the
subject[s]/keyword[s] of:

Hungary  OR   ____________  OR  ___________   OR   ____________

Please send me this bibliography for all years in your computerized
index.

This is a request for DTIC records, please do not forward my request to
NTIS.  Please include an index for unclassified, limited and classified
records in your search.  If any of the records are limited or
classified, please review them for release, or else the release of
nonsensitive portions.

I am an individual, noncommercial requester and this request is not
being made for commercial purposes.  [OR YOU MIGHT INSTEAD INDICATE
DIFFERENTLY IF YOU ARE A COMMERCIAL REQUESTER, OR AN EDUCATIONAL OR
SCIENTIFIC INSTITUTION, OR A REPRESENTATIVE OF THE MEDIA]

[If I have indicated that I am writing from an educational or scientific
institution, I have enclosed evidence of this.  If you do not accept
such evidence, please place me into the "all other requesters"
category.]

I also agree to pay up to $25 for reasonable fees associated with this
request.


Sincerely,


________________



Hope you find this a useful resource.
Michael Ravnitzky

+ - Re: Health Care and the GDP (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

I would like to state right here at the beginning (and this is not
the first time that I am stating it) that I am not in favor of the current
American health-care system. However, trained as an academic, I have a
compulsion to arrive at the truth.
        The fact is that the Canadian health-care system is far from perfect
and costs about the same as the American; that is, about 13 percent of the
GDP. Joe's figures are seven years old and since then health-care costs in
Canada went up considerably. The last I heard (and unfortunately I just
heard it on National Public Radio and therefore I can't reproduce it. You
just have to believe me.) that Canada just surpassed the United States in
health expenditures (percentage of GDP/person).
        And by the way, my good friend from Germany promised me a more
detailed description of the German situation. I will let you know.
        In any case, what I am driving at is that I am coming to the
conclusion that health care is one of the thorniest problems of late
twentieth-century life. Yes, we can tinker with it but even the so-called
perfect systems turn out to be less than perfect and inordinately expensive.
        Eva Balogh
+ - Re: NATO Expansion (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 09:10 AM 3/11/97 -0500, Darren Purcell wrote:
>I find the recent discussion of NATO expansion fascinating. I see people
>making arguments to delineate who is worthy, who is not. the arguments
>seem to me to be like a pecking order, trying to reestablish some sort of
>hierarchy. My travels and living experiences in Hungary, Romania, and
>Slovakia have convinced me that there is a mental perception of a pecking
>order, and I am beginning to believe I can see it on this list as well.
>
>One person has argued that they would allow only those that can be solid
>members, making contributions to the goals and values or NATO. However,
>what are those goals today, the Muslim boogeyman or the guranteeing of a
>space that facilitates commerce and trade, allowing further growth in
>Europe.
>
>

Darren, one could argue that at this point in time the Central European
countries need NATO more than the other way.  Unless Russia regains her
economic strength AND becomes belligerent, there is no major threat from
that corner.  NATO's mission is, therefore, more of a peacekeeping and
war-prevention alliance, trying to avoid the likes of a Yugoslav civil war
elsewhere.  Burying troubling war axes like the Hungarian - Romanian
conflict give both countries a much better chance to join NATO.

As I have said several times, NATO, IMHO, is the main pre-qualification test
for entry into EU, which is literally a matter of economic life or death for
all Central European countries.  Without the NATO "seal of approval"  there
is  little chance of EU membership.

As far as Turkey's place in NATO, I agree that today it may seem out of
place, if one judges solely from a political point of view.  At the time of
her admission, Turkey occupied a most strategic role in NATO due to her
geographic location, on the underbelly of the Soviet Union, closer to her
rocket center than any European country.  Turkey was our "Cuba".  Indeed,
the secret and highly valuable U-2 missions photographic Soviet military
installations were flow from Turkey, giving the planes more range than if
they were flown from Western Europe.  The Cuban missile crisis was also
started when we decided to move missiles into Turkey.

Turkey still occupies a critical place in the alliance.  During Desert
Storm, air bases in Turkey were used to send or receive flights by aircraft
starting out or landing on carriers in the Gulf or in Saudi Arabia.  Given
the Western world's ( BTW, Europe more than the US) dependence on Gulf oil,
Turkey remains crucial to our system of defenses.

regards,



Charlie Vamossy
+ - Re: NATO Expansion (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 10:49 AM 3/12/97 -0500, you wrote:

>        Bosnia-Hercegovina did not have an "OK" government in control
>of the country's territory, its ethnic make-up bears no comparison to
>Slovakia, the nearest NATO country was 'two countries away', there was
>no external threat to NATO, the war was instigated by a neighbor's
>interest in "its" ethnic minority and territory in B-H.
>
>
>But that was precisely the point: NATO membership
>will not take care of a country's internal politics,
>and in the case of Slovakia is of little strategic
>relevance if Hungary and Poland are members.  Making
>a fuss about it is either an unintentional ill-informed
>symbolic substitute for discussing the real issues or
>a deliberate decoy.
>
>
>Martin
>

As a pre-admission qualifier to EU, NATO membership is critical to all
Central European countries, including H and SK.  Without US involvement, the
Western European countries are reluctant to do anything to ensure peace in
their own sphere (witness Yugoslavia).  NATO's entrance requirements also
include certain political and economic requirements that are the same as the
EU's.  It is this area that Slovakia seems to be lagging behind other
candidates, as evidenced by a long list of demarches issued to Slovakia by
various European entities.

regards,



Charlie Vamossy
+ - HL-Action: Collective Human Rights (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

****************** CALL FOR ACTION ****************

Priority:
 normal

Background:
  Our thousands of letters and nearly a dozen newspaper advertisements
have reached President Clinton and we stand a good chance that
American support for COLLECTIVE HUMAN RIGHTS will become an integral
part of American foreign policy. The people who took the trouble to
write deserve our thanks. The continuation of this effort is the prime
task of the Hungarian Lobby.

What to do:
  Please write President Clinton and ask him to make the collective
  human
rights an integral part of American foreign policy. Please send them
out every day(!)  Please, distribute them to all your acquaintances
who care about human rights.
  Feel free to use the attached sample letters: letter #1 is
  applicable
for Hungarian-Americans, letter #2 for non-American citizens. 

  Address of Clinton (e-mail):
    

**************************************************************

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
letter #1 for Hungarian-Americans:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<date>

President Bill Clinton
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington, DC
(e-mail:  )

RE:  Support for Collective Human Rights in Central Europe

Dear Mr. President:

Every culture is sacred. The destruction of a single one mutilates the
heritage of the entire human race. International standards are needed
to protect them all. We Americans must accept the historical
responsibility of leading in the development of international
standards which will protect the collective human rights of all
indigenous minority groups. 

We must lead as we pass over the bridge to the 21st century, just as
we led during the Second World War when we decided to protect the
individual human rights of all. Collective human rights flow from
those of the individual because such basic rights as the use of one's
language can only be practiced in groups. There is no other choice. 
There are no melting pots in the Screbenicas of the world. The
alternative to cultural autonomy is mass graves and cultural genocide.


Mr. President:  In this century the United States was obliged to
intervene in Europe three times. The only way to permanently eliminate
the need for sending our troops on similar missions in the future is
to eliminate the cause of these conflicts. This should be done by
uniformly satisfying the aspirations of all indigenous minority
groups. If, as the President of the United States, you would make the
defense of collective human rights and cultural autonomy a cornerstone
of your foreign policy, you would permanently eliminate the need for
our GIs to get entangled in future European conflicts. 

As a member of the 1.58 million-member community of
Hungarian-Americans, I ask you to make the cultural autonomy of all
indigenous national minorities of Central Europe an integral part of
your foreign policy. 

Respectfully,

<Your name, address and title> (If this letter is signed by many,
please use the attached form to list the names and addresses.)

cc:  Vice President Al Gore
)

NAME                                  ADDRESS
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________



xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
letter #2 for non-American citizens:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<date>

President Bill Clinton
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington, DC
(e-mail:  )

RE: Support Collective Human Rights in Central Europe

Dear Mr. President:

Every culture is sacred. The destruction of a single one mutilates the
heritage of the entire human race. International standards are needed
to protect them all. The Americans must accept the historical
responsibility of leading in the development of international
standards which will protect the collective human rights of all
indigenous minority groups. 

The USA must lead as we pass over the bridge to the 21st century, just
as you led during the Second World War when you decided to protect the
individual human rights of all. Collective human rights flow from
those of the individual because such basic rights as the use of one's
language can only be practiced in groups. There is no other choice. 
There are no melting pots in the Screbenicas of the world. The
alternative to cultural autonomy is mass graves and cultural genocide.


Mr. President:  In this century the United States was obliged to
intervene in Europe three times. The only way to permanently eliminate
the need for sending your troops on similar missions in the future is
to eliminate the cause of these conflicts. This should be done by
uniformly satisfying the aspirations of all indigenous minority
groups. If, as the President of the United States, you would make the
defense of collective human rights and cultural autonomy a cornerstone
of your foreign policy, you would permanently eliminate the need for
your GIs to get entangled in future European conflicts. 

As a human right activist, I ask you to make the cultural autonomy of
all indigenous national minorities of Central Europe an integral part
of your foreign policy. 

Respectfully,

<Your name, address and title> (If this letter is signed by many,
please use the attached form to list the names and addresses.)

cc: Vice President Al Gore
)

NAME                                  ADDRESS
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
+ - HL-Action: Collective Human Rights (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

****************** CALL FOR ACTION ****************

Priority:
 normal

Background:
  Our thousands of letters and nearly a dozen newspaper advertisements
have reached President Clinton and we stand a good chance that
American support for COLLECTIVE HUMAN RIGHTS will become an integral
part of American foreign policy. The people who took the trouble to
write deserve our thanks. The continuation of this effort is the prime
task of the Hungarian Lobby.

What to do:
  Please write President Clinton and ask him to make the collective
  human
rights an integral part of American foreign policy. Please send them
out every day(!)  Please, distribute them to all your acquaintances
who care about human rights.
  Feel free to use the attached sample letters: letter #1 is
  applicable
for Hungarian-Americans, letter #2 for non-American citizens.

  Address of Clinton (e-mail):
   

**************************************************************

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
letter #1 for Hungarian-Americans:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<date>

President Bill Clinton
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington, DC
(e-mail:  )

RE:  Support for Collective Human Rights in Central Europe

Dear Mr. President:

Every culture is sacred. The destruction of a single one mutilates the
heritage of the entire human race. International standards are needed
to protect them all. We Americans must accept the historical
responsibility of leading in the development of international
standards which will protect the collective human rights of all
indigenous minority groups.

We must lead as we pass over the bridge to the 21st century, just as
we led during the Second World War when we decided to protect the
individual human rights of all. Collective human rights flow from
those of the individual because such basic rights as the use of one's
language can only be practiced in groups. There is no other choice.
There are no melting pots in the Screbenicas of the world. The
alternative to cultural autonomy is mass graves and cultural genocide.


Mr. President:  In this century the United States was obliged to
intervene in Europe three times. The only way to permanently eliminate
the need for sending our troops on similar missions in the future is
to eliminate the cause of these conflicts. This should be done by
uniformly satisfying the aspirations of all indigenous minority
groups. If, as the President of the United States, you would make the
defense of collective human rights and cultural autonomy a cornerstone
of your foreign policy, you would permanently eliminate the need for
our GIs to get entangled in future European conflicts.

As a member of the 1.58 million-member community of
Hungarian-Americans, I ask you to make the cultural autonomy of all
indigenous national minorities of Central Europe an integral part of
your foreign policy.

Respectfully,

<Your name, address and title> (If this letter is signed by many,
please use the attached form to list the names and addresses.)

cc:  Vice President Al Gore
)

NAME                                  ADDRESS
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________



xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
letter #2 for non-American citizens:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<date>

President Bill Clinton
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington, DC
(e-mail:  )

RE: Support Collective Human Rights in Central Europe

Dear Mr. President:

Every culture is sacred. The destruction of a single one mutilates the
heritage of the entire human race. International standards are needed
to protect them all. The Americans must accept the historical
responsibility of leading in the development of international
standards which will protect the collective human rights of all
indigenous minority groups.

The USA must lead as we pass over the bridge to the 21st century, just
as you led during the Second World War when you decided to protect the
individual human rights of all. Collective human rights flow from
those of the individual because such basic rights as the use of one's
language can only be practiced in groups. There is no other choice.
There are no melting pots in the Screbenicas of the world. The
alternative to cultural autonomy is mass graves and cultural genocide.


Mr. President:  In this century the United States was obliged to
intervene in Europe three times. The only way to permanently eliminate
the need for sending your troops on similar missions in the future is
to eliminate the cause of these conflicts. This should be done by
uniformly satisfying the aspirations of all indigenous minority
groups. If, as the President of the United States, you would make the
defense of collective human rights and cultural autonomy a cornerstone
of your foreign policy, you would permanently eliminate the need for
your GIs to get entangled in future European conflicts.

As a human right activist, I ask you to make the cultural autonomy of
all indigenous national minorities of Central Europe an integral part
of your foreign policy.

Respectfully,

<Your name, address and title> (If this letter is signed by many,
please use the attached form to list the names and addresses.)

cc: Vice President Al Gore
)

NAME                                  ADDRESS
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
______________________________________________________________________
+ - Re: Anglo-Saxons (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

In article >, Denes BOGSANYI
> writes:

>Subject:       Re: Anglo-Saxons
>From:  Denes BOGSANYI >
>Date:  Thu, 13 Mar 1997 20:16:14 +1000
>
>With regard to WWI we have to consider that the political leaders were =
>pro British while a large proportion of the population being Irish were =
>livid at doing anything to help them. It needed sustained propaganda for =
>which the Germans supplied incidents such as the Lusitania for these to =
>come around.

Your grasp of turn-of-the-century demographics in the U.S. is less than
breath-taking. The proportion of Irish in the U.S. population was most likely
less than that of Americans with English, African and German roots. Ever seen
that great movie with Jimmy Cagney called "The Fighting 69th"? Many of the men
in that regiment were first and second-generation Irish and they had no problem
fighting for the U.S. against the Germans. Woodrow Wilson was no more
pro-British than most presidents who had immediately pr

>In the case of WW II the situation is much more murky. Germany was an =
>ally of Russia while it suited her to attack and conquer France in =
>particular. The USA stood by and made sure every last bolt was paid for =
>by the British in gold. Only when she had been stripped of her assets =
>did the USA send considerable manpower to Europe.

Bullshit. Ever hear of the Lend-Lease Program? We gave the British ships and
other war material well in advance of ever entering the war and Roosevelt
caught hell from Republican isolationists who accused him of: a) trying to get
us involved in the war when we ought to stay neutral and b)giving millions of
dollars in war material to Britain and getting nothing in return. We were even
providing active anti-submarine coverage for British shipping off the East
Coast of the U.S. well in advance of December, 194
Sam Stowe





"Come on and do what you did;
Roll me under New Madrid..."
-- Uncle Tupelo
+ - Re: NATO Expansion (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

Dear Martin,


>> Meciar at the moment is embarking on a referendum which will surely
>> defeat any Slovak desire (of which there is none) to join
>> NATO. Meciar knows that Slovakia has not met the requirements for
>> NATO membership. Its democracy is highly questionable.
>
>There's often a problem with what is meant by quasi-generic reference:
>"Slovak desire" may refer to the present government or the citizens of
>Slovakia.  Specific reference avoids that.

        Of course, you are right. I meant the current Slovak government.

>In two recent Western reviews of democratic standards in the world,
>Slovakia got a "B" (A=best, D=worst).  Turkey, a NATO member, got a
>"C/D".  Of course, when Turkey joined NATO in 1952 its internal
>politics was disregarded for strategic reasons.

        I bet that today Turkey wouldn't get close to NATO. And now they are
threatening to veto the entrance of the East European countries, if they
themelves don't get into the European Union.

>        Strategically, Slovakia might have little to worry about if
>Hungary and Poland were in NATO (unless things change in Budapest).
>Its 56-mile long border with (the) Ukraine should be defensible for a
>country of its size.  Its internal politics is what matters.

        If by that you mean that if Meciar leaves the scene and if the West
thinks that Slovakia's internal policies are more democratic, I am sure
Slovakia could join NATO and the European Union easily. But not until then,
I don't think.
        ESB
+ - Re: Health Care and the GDP (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

At 09:16 AM 3/14/97 -0500, Eva Balogh wrote:

>        I would like to state right here at the beginning (and this is not
>the first time that I am stating it) that I am not in favor of the current
>American health-care system.

That leaves you with two options.  One would be to have a fully socialized
system like Canada has, or, you could have a completely private system which
would resemble the present American model - minus medicare and medicaid.
Which would you prefer?

>However, trained as an academic, I have a compulsion to arrive at the truth.

You are sooo stubborn, Eva.  Because the numbers for your argument don't
exist, you pull the academic card.  From here on, you want to impress upon
the readers and me that, statistics and numbers aside, you are driven to
arrive at the truth because of 'training'.  And, if I am to follow your
logic, because I don't have this training, I'm not as seriously interested
in arriving at the truth.  It's strange, but you remind me of a priest, a
mufti.
>        The fact is that the Canadian health-care system is far from perfect
>and costs about the same as the American; that is, about 13 percent of the
>GDP.

And your source is ...... ?

>Joe's figures are seven years old and since then health-care costs in
>Canada went up considerably.

And they went down in the United States?  What is your source?

>The last I heard (and unfortunately I just heard it on National Public
Radio >and therefore I can't reproduce it. You just have to believe me.)
that >Canada just surpassed the United States in health expenditures
(percentage >of GDP/person).

Oh really?  There are so many right-wing politicians running amuck in
Canada, trying to destroy our health care system, that I'm sure they'd use
information like that to bolster their arguments before it got to National
Public Radio.  And, can I assume that you heard, what you heard on NPR,
*before* the announcements of massive hospital closures in Ontario?  As I
stated in a previous post, a third of the hospitals in Toronto, and many
others throughout Ontario, are to be closed.  That, undoubtedly, will reduce
the cost of health care per person as a percentage of the GDP in Canada.  As
a matter of fact, the only French language hospital in Ontario, located in
Ottawa, is to be closed.  When our right-wing premier, Mike Harris, was
questioned about the closure, he said that if anyone in Ontario wanted to go
to a French language hospital, they could go to Hull.  (OK.  In the interest
of "truth", he didn't say that, but I just couldn't resist the line.)

>        And by the way, my good friend from Germany promised me a more
>detailed description of the German situation. I will let you know.

Thank you.

>        In any case, what I am driving at is that I am coming to the
>conclusion that health care is one of the thorniest problems of late
>twentieth-century life. Yes, we can tinker with it but even the so-called
>perfect systems turn out to be less than perfect and inordinately expensive.

You use the word 'perfect' three times in your post.  I present numbers that
show that the Canadian health care system is not nearly as expensive as the
American, and you respond by attacking 'perfect systems'.  Who was talking
about 'perfect systems'?

Joe Szalai

If poetry is like an orgasm, an academic can be likened to someone who
studies the passion-stains on the bedsheets.
      - Irving Layton, Canadian poet
+ - Re: NATO Expansion (mind) VÁLASZ  Feladó: (cikkei)

>>        Strategically, Slovakia might have little to worry about if
>>Hungary and Poland were in NATO (unless things change in Budapest).
>>Its 56-mile long border with (the) Ukraine should be defensible for a
>>country of its size.  Its internal politics is what matters.
>
>        If by that you mean that if Meciar leaves the scene and if the West
>thinks that Slovakia's internal policies are more democratic, I am sure
>Slovakia could join NATO and the European Union easily. But not until then,

        Yes, worrying about Slovakia not joining NATO is putting the
cart before the horse.  Slovakia has no strategic need to join NATO,
if Hungary and Poland are members.  The issue of joining should be
point #274 on the list of goals to try and work towards in Slovakia.

        NATO membership might be important for the reason Charles
mentions, i.e. if it is indeed a prerequisite for EU membership (and
if that were to Slovakia's economic advantage -- I'm inclined to
believe it would, especially if the EU takes the same line it did with
Portugal and Spain).  My suspicion is that the EU would not care
whether its potential member is in NATO if Brussels' economic and
political expectations were seen as met (Austria, Finland, Sweden,
Portugal, Spain; but not Turkey).

        Of course, the ex-Comecon countries are not an Austria or even a
Finland, so there are those 273 points to take care of in Slovakia and
they are the real issues, unlike the current symbolic substitute (or some
politicians' deliberate decoy?) of arguing about NATO membership. If they
are taken care of, Slovakia's membership or a lack thereof will not matter
to its security, nor to its potential NATO neighbors, to return it to the
topic of this list.


Martin



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