||Mailing lists information - attn: Moderator (mind)
|| 43 sor
||At Verecke (mind)
|| 39 sor
||Re: The working-class movement (mind)
|| 14 sor
||CHEAP LODGING IN BUDAPEST (mind)
|| 25 sor
||Re: Mailing lists information - attn: Moderator (mind)
|| 66 sor
||Re: Mailing lists information - attn: Moderator (mind)
|| 53 sor
||Re: And now something entirely different: technical lis (mind)
|| 36 sor
||Re: American Imperialism (mind)
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||Re: Sophistry (mind)
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|+ - ||Mailing lists information - attn: Moderator (mind)
I'm forwarding this announcement to the list since it might be of some
interest to list members. Caveat emptor!
I would like to bring to your attention two mailing lists, EEUROPE-CHANGES
and EEUROPE-BUSINESS, both located at address >.
EEUROPE-CHANGES is a discussion list only, no commercial advertisements or
product plugging are allowed. Discussion is wide open, no holds barred,
controversial topics welcomed, political, economic and social matters
discussed. List was started due to the fact that large part of e-mail users
Eastern Europe have no access to USENET and its groups with a similar topics.
List publishes articles by Western journalists based in Eastern Europe and
various analysts of East European matters. Archives for the list are located at
EEUROPE-BUSINESS is very business-minded list, where business offers, leads,
requests for goods and services, and advertisements are published (and
welcomed), various government and export information, calls for papers, etc.
are published - almost no discussion takes place. All postings must be from
/ have relation to / be of possible interest of people from Eastern Europe.
A must for every business person contemplating a business with Eastern Europe.
Business leads archive and other info is at <http://www.ijs.com/naafetee>.
To subscribe EEUROPE-CHANGES:
Send command (in the body of text) SUBSCRIBE EEUROPE-CHANGES
To subscribe EEUROPE-BUSINESS:
Send command (in the body of text) SUBSCRIBE EEUROPE-BUSINESS
In case of any trouble with subscribing, send complaint to
|+ - ||At Verecke (mind)
In 895 AD the main contingent of the westward trekking Hungarian tribes
entered the Carpathian Basin at Verecke, about 30 km north of where
the town of Munkacs is now located. This event occupies a special place
in the psyche of Hungarians, and especially in those who belong to the
Hungarian community of Karpatalja, a region now also called Carpatho-Ukraine.
To commemorate the 1100th anniversary of this historic event, Hungarians
of the region bought land at Verecke with the intention of erecting a
fitting memorial. It was to be a replacement of one which was destroyed
as suzerainty of the land changed several times in this century. (It is
not unusual to find older people living there whose nationality has
changed three or four times without a physical move on their part due to
the redrawing of borders, of course, without a plebiscite.)
A hilltop with spectacular view of the verdant countryside was chosen as
an appropriate site, reminding the visitor of the Skyline Drive along
the Shenandoah. When completed, the memorial will consist of seven
stacked slabs, symbolizing the seven Hungarian tribes, built up as a
truncated obelisk. The mythical turul bird will decorate the top. The
project is well on its way, and as a recent visitor learned, it is
guarded against vandals by a dog of unfathomable intentions.
But construction was abruptly ordered to be halted. Bowing to
anti-Hungarian ultra nationalists, the Ukrainian authorities forbade the
completion of the project. In fact, as a worker related, officials
"sealed" the machines at the construction site. The locals have not
given up. Many realize that the road to Europe leads thru many
switchbacks and eventually the monument, a reminder of the history
shared by all who come from the area, will be completed. It is only a
matter of time before the turul bird will once again look toward the
The reaction of the foreign ministry in Budapest to this flagrant violation
of elemental human rights of ethnic Hungarians living in close proximity of
the Hungarian border is an acid test of its character. Cynics think that
given the background of the players, "socialist solidarity" once again will
win out. Regretably, they are probably right.
CSABA K ZOLTANI
|+ - ||Re: The working-class movement (mind)
In article >,
> You know what Joe Szalai, you think whatever you want to think about
>the working-class movement and the history which was concocted around it.
>Your opinion in no way will influence my assessment of the Hungarian
Wow, this little bit of juvenility makes a really terrific refutation of
What's the matter? Not up to the debate? How disappointing. ;-)
George Szaszvari, DCPS Chess Club, 42 Alleyn Park, London SE21 7AA, UK
Planet Earth, Milky Way Galaxy * ARM Club * C=64..ICPUG * NW London CC
|+ - ||CHEAP LODGING IN BUDAPEST (mind)
Someone wrote a request for cheap lodging in Budapest. Well... I've got the
best plan for you. The best places to stay in Hungary in the summer months are
University dormitories. The students are away for summer and the rooms are
rented out to tourists at a VERY reasonable price. One place in particular
that I would highly recommend is a place I stayed at last summer. It is a
dormitory belonging to a university called ELTE. You have two options to
choose from. 1) You can rent a whole room for 500,-HUF per night(about $4.00
US). This gives you three beds , three desks and your own private bathroom
(soap and towels included) The rooms are very clean and very nice and some
even have a balcony with a rather nice view. 2) You can rent a bed in a room
with other guests of the dormitory. This costs a mere 100,-HUF per night(about
$0.50 US). However you will have to share a common bathroom in the hall with
other guests as well as share a room with people that you might not know. If
you are with a group of friends you would be better off to get one of the
private rooms with your own bathroom.
The dormitory is located in Budapest's district XI on the corner of
Budaorsi ut. and Dayka Gabor u. You can get there easily by taxi or by getting
of the subway (Metro) at Deli Pu. and catching a #139 bus to Dayka Gabor utca.
When you get off the bus at Dayka Gabor utca you will notice a fenced in
complex with several good sized builings behind the bus stop. Walk up Dayka
Gabor u. and go through the gate and give the nice man your money. It's that
easy! Have a good time in Hungary! Say hi to my grandmother for me!
|+ - ||Re: Mailing lists information - attn: Moderator (mind)
EEUROPE-BUSINESS unfortunately has very little relevance to Hungary as most
of their business leads concern Russia and other countries, not Hungary.
Thus your caveat emptor warning is appropriate.
The real problem with the list is that it is simply impossible to
unsubscribe from it. I have made the mistake some months ago and signed up
for it. I realized my mistake and have been ever since trying to
The letter you forwarded contains no instructions on how to get off this
list. Perhaps you can contact the owner and prevail on him to add the
proper instructions getting off the list, not just getting on.
At 12:41 AM 8/8/96 EDT, you wrote:
>I'm forwarding this announcement to the list since it might be of some
>interest to list members. Caveat emptor!
>I would like to bring to your attention two mailing lists, EEUROPE-CHANGES
>and EEUROPE-BUSINESS, both located at address >.
>EEUROPE-CHANGES is a discussion list only, no commercial advertisements or
>product plugging are allowed. Discussion is wide open, no holds barred,
>controversial topics welcomed, political, economic and social matters
>discussed. List was started due to the fact that large part of e-mail users
>Eastern Europe have no access to USENET and its groups with a similar topics.
>List publishes articles by Western journalists based in Eastern Europe and
>various analysts of East European matters. Archives for the list are located a
>EEUROPE-BUSINESS is very business-minded list, where business offers, leads,
>requests for goods and services, and advertisements are published (and
>welcomed), various government and export information, calls for papers, etc.
>are published - almost no discussion takes place. All postings must be from
>/ have relation to / be of possible interest of people from Eastern Europe.
>A must for every business person contemplating a business with Eastern Europe.
>Business leads archive and other info is at <http://www.ijs.com/naafetee>.
>To subscribe EEUROPE-CHANGES:
>Send command (in the body of text) SUBSCRIBE EEUROPE-CHANGES
>To subscribe EEUROPE-BUSINESS:
>Send command (in the body of text) SUBSCRIBE EEUROPE-BUSINESS
>In case of any trouble with subscribing, send complaint to
|+ - ||Re: Mailing lists information - attn: Moderator (mind)
The owner of the eeurope-changes list, Mr. Ross Hedvicek, sends this
response to the comments of Mr. Vamossy about the lists. I'm forwarding
it to the whole list at his suggestion.
Yes, I remember Mr. Vamossy and his problems with unsubscribing - his
problems with unsubscribing were actually so rare that I still remember that
after almost a year. :-) Mr. Vammosy problem at that time was that he used
incorrect commands and sent them to incorrect addresses (after he contacted
me, he was unsubscribed immediately). Our software is LISTMANAGER and
majority of LISTSERV command simply do not work here, also sending
listmanager command to the list, to be distributed to 4000 people, will not
do any good as well. We try to prevent similar situations by adding a FOOTER
with instructions "how to unsubscribe" to EVERY digest we send out. I can
say that we have almost NO problems with unsubscribing now - with exception
of people who are unable to read the instruction in footer, or change the
address and then try to unsubscribe address, which is NOT in our database.
Mr. Vamossy is also right about little relevance to Hungary so far - it has
changed slightly since his times and this is also the reason why I am trying
to attract more Hungarians to it - so it will be changed completely. Simply,
list is available to Hungarians as well - they just did not post too often
in it (at this point we have about 40 subscribers from .hu domain).
Here is sample of footer (I was describing above), attached to EACH digest,
with instructions on how to unsubscribe:
While the EEUROPE-CHANGES is intentionally NOT moderated, we do
not encourage any flame wars, posting of chain letters or matters clearly
unrelated to Eastern Europe. To post your message to this list, send it
to automated address >, there is no
"request" or "digest" in it. To unsubscribe, send a UNSUBSCRIBE
EEUROPE-CHANGES command to >. For information
on other commands, send command HELP to > or
e-mail to >. Direct all business matters, leads, ads
and commercial offers to >.
To conclude - I think that all problems commented on by Mr. Vamossy are
fixed now and I again invite all interested (from Hungary or elsewhere) to
join the list - not only the business one, but even that new one - more
political/economic one - EEUROPE-CHANGES.
|+ - ||Re: And now something entirely different: technical lis (mind)
In article >,
>In article >,
>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Apropos a couple of complaints I've seen recently about trouble with
>>reading the HUNGARY list: let me re-iterate that the only reliable way
>>receiving the list traffic is via email (from ,
>>via HIX if one wishes to use the secondary source instead).
>>there are some persistent problems with the Usenet side of the
>>bit.listserv.hungary, that often cause prolonged delays lasting days
>>opposed to the near-instantenous delivery to email subscribers) and not
>>infrequently total loss of some articles.
>FYI, I always access this list via bit.listserv.hungary and have
>no problems whatsoever. When I post a message here, it seems to
>get posted immediately. Am I just lucky? Or are there servers that
>are more reliable than others?
>Steven C. Scheer
I also get this list via bit.listserv.hungary, and have no trouble to
post my messages. However - maybe someone can help me here - whenever I
shut down my Navigator, all my messages posted on WNwin (not only this
list) are shown as errors. My server has no answers. ANybody with this
|+ - ||Re: American Imperialism (mind)
In article >,
>At 10:40 AM 8/5/96 -0400, Frank Aycock wrote:
>>Actually, if the U.S. did take over Canada then English would become
>>official language of Canada, too, like the Congress is doing right now.
>>Canadians would no longer need bilingual signs! :-) :-) :-)
>I'm in favour of bilingual signs. Official bilingualism acknowledges
>Canada is not just an English speaking nation. It also sets Canadians
>from that 'Great Satan' to the south.
>I think that bilingual signs would be a good think in Slovakia and
>It would make the Magyar speaking people feel a bit more at home in
>countries. As it is now, the Slovak and Romanian law makers just have
>glance at America's unilingual law and feel that they too are moving in
Hear, hear! Maybe you send an E-mail message about this to the Quebec
|+ - ||Re: Sophistry (mind)
At Sun Aug 4 21:17:25 EDT 1996 HUNGARY #749 Farkas D. Gabor wrote:
>>[...] nobody was ever taught the original
>>name of Rakosi, Farkas (no relation, hopefully ;-) to our Gabor), and some
>>the others mentioned in this context. So identifying their original names
>>may provide additional information, not commonly available to the average
>I don't know if there is a relation.
So you see, Gabor, knowing the original name can help.
All you need to know is what your (or your ancestors')
original name was. Unfortunately, I can't help you with
Mihaly Farkas' original name: all I remember is his first
>Why? If this Farkas were related to me, would I be in any way responsible
>for his deeds, whatever they are? Also, please tell me, what is the value of
>the additional information so obtained?
Of course you would not be responsible. But I guess you
wouldn't be real proud, either. Hopefully :-)
The value of the information, for you, would be to either
prove or disprove the relationship, since you don't know.
>>The fact that they happened to be Jewish names need not worry the Jews on
>>this list. I don't think anyone here is going to be blamed for the crimes
>>Rakosi and his ilk.
>I hope not. However, here is my (in your opinion paranoid) view: when
>someone writes Rakosi (Rosenfeld), he is planting and promoting the idea
>that the whole communist plague was brought upon us by Jews. And why are the
>Jews paranoid about this? There is a good Romanian saying about this: once
>you burn your mouth with the soup, you blow even the yoghurt.
I like this saying. How true.
>>I guess the fear is that someone, by compiling the list of evildoers and
>>showing that a certain number of them were Jewish will, somehow, come up
>>a theory of some Jewish conspiracy.
>This is not fear. This is happening. Because those who compile these lists
>don't stop there.
>> And these good people think that the
>>best defense against such a thing happening is to silence, at whatever
>>those who would advance such ideas. But this is dead wrong. Precisely by
>>not confronting ideas they think erroneous or harmful, they lend credence
>>some of the craziest theories.
>One thing I cannot be accused of is that I did not confront these ideas.
I mean confront them with arguments, not by name-calling.
>> Let those who will advance theories of
>>conspiracy of any kind speak their mind, then offer counterarguments to
>>demolish those theories in a fair debate. That is what I mean by "search
>>the truth wherever it may lead". The truth will triumph in rational
>> Irrational theories will be laughed out of the arena.
>We are saturated with quotes from The Protocols of The Elders of Zion and
>other "scholarly" works. They have been laughed out already. But they just
>Gabor D. Farkas
I don't know what the Protocols are. Are they real or forged documents?
If, as you imply, they are not real, why waste time on them? I would
appreciate it if you would briefly describe them to me. Thanks in advance.