||Finnish president in Hungary (mind)
|| 7 sor
||The World Federation of Hungarians (MVSZ) (mind)
|| 35 sor
||Economy Vignettes (mind)
|| 32 sor
||Re: Cultural events at the Hungarian Embassy, USA (mind)
|| 13 sor
||Economic Meltdown.... (mind)
|| 22 sor
||Hungarian Hirlevel Free Trial Subscription (mind)
|| 17 sor
||Unbearable Burdens (mind)
|| 57 sor
||Searching for Roots (mind)
|| 10 sor
||Kollektiv level a Kormanynak (mind)
|| 31 sor
||Lost souls on the information superhighway (mind)
|| 11 sor
||Re: Unbearable Burdens (mind)
|| 18 sor
||Old Habits (mind)
|| 26 sor
||Re: REQ: bills (mind)
|| 48 sor
|+ - ||Finnish president in Hungary (mind)
The president of Finland, Mr. Martti Ahtisaari has been in Hungary for a
couple of days now. He has often been having a good time when he's been
abroad, e.g. in Stockholm he got quite drunk and fell under the table or
something like that. Any rumours about his actions in Budapest right now?
University of Helsinki
|+ - ||The World Federation of Hungarians (MVSZ) (mind)
On March 9, 1995 Hugh Agnew wrote:
>And, just BTW, may I mildly second the suggestion that, if anyone begins
>reading this list traffic and doesn't "find what [they] want," that they
>post something to start something else rolling? [...]
>So, how about a general CALL FOR NEW TOPICS?
This is my suggestion. I would like start a discussion about the World
Federation of Hungarians (MVSZ). This organization was quite active during
the Kadar years. They published a nice bi-weekly (later monthly) magazine,
organized summer camps for kids, supported the teaching Hungarian in the
diaspora, arranged the tour of "cultural ambassadors" to the West, etc.
They were accused of being a tool of communist propaganda machine.
In 1992 the MVSZ was reorganized. During the III. Congress of Hungarians
they elected Sa1ndor Csoo1ri to be the new president, and promised a new
active role for the organization in keeping the Hungarian diaspora
informed. They started a bi-weekly newspaper, the Vila1gszo2vetseg. This
paper since died, I never heard anything about the MVSZ lately. I assumed
that the organization just quietly faded away with many other relics of the
Kadar regime. Therefore, I was surprised to read in the Dec. 19, 1995 issue
of the Hungarian daily newspaper Magyar Nemzet, that Be1la Pomoga1ts, one of
the vice-presidents of MVSZ, is still looking for "new ways to
communicate" with the Hungarian communities of the West.
I wonder why they did not think of the Internet. In the very same issue of
the Magyar Nemzet where Mr. Pomoga1ts is looking for the ways of
communication, a news item proudly announces that since 1993 Hungary is on
the Internet. So I would suggest to Mr. Pomoga1ts and the other Officials of
the MVSz that, please put the MVSZ on the Hungarian Homepage. Let the
diaspora know what your plans are, let us comment on your plans. Would
anybody second this suggestion?
|+ - ||Economy Vignettes (mind)
Intersting tid-bits from the March 1,1995 Hungarian Business Weekly:
Bekesi speaking at Budapest Economic U. "There is no economic growth
concievable that could generate enough revenue to cover these (debt
Current hard currency savings in Hungary : $2.5 billion
January inflation 4% over Dec. Past 12 month inflation 22.1%. Previous 12
According to Hungarian police the monthly amount of forged HUF is 1-1.5
billion! (Who says there are no enterprenours in Hungary?)
72% of Hungarian exports to OECD,EU and EFTA countries.
Employment of the 10,278,000 population was 5,015,000 in 1993 and 4,768,000
The Opel,Audi,Ford and Suzuki plants operating in Hungary spawned over 200
small busnisses in Hungary to supply them with parts. Domestic automotive
business now is $909million/year out of total $29 billion/year domestic
As a favor for giving data from issue, the subscription address for the
Hungarian Business Weekly is:
2 Wisconsin Circle #700
Chevy Chase MD 20815
|+ - ||Re: Cultural events at the Hungarian Embassy, USA (mind)
If anyone is planning to attend John Lukacs's lecture on April 7, I would
be very interested in a summary of what he says (or if there are copies of
his talk available, I could send a snail-mail address). If it doesn't seem
relevant to the list as a whole, please send it to me as e-mail...
|+ - ||Economic Meltdown.... (mind)
It seems that the economy is out of control.. Since Horn is unable to implemen
drastic financial measures, I expect a Mexico type meltdown by the summer.
Any comments ?
OMRI DAILY DIGEST
No. 49, 9 March 1995
HUNGARIAN BUDGET DEFICIT. According to data released by the Finance
Ministry on 8 March, Hungary's budget deficit at the end of February
amounted to 83.6 billion forint or almost 30% of the year-end target,
MTI reports. A spokesman for the ministry warned that effective measures
are needed to prevent or cut the further growth of the deficit. He
pointed out that revenues totaled 168.5 billion forint, which was far
less than planned, while expenditures rose to 252.1 billion forint.
Revenues from privatization, which were expected to reach 25 billion
forint during the first two months of the year, did not materialize at
all, the spokesman said. Consumption-related revenues were half of the
two-month target, and net value-added tax revenues were only 0.4% of the
annual target. -- Edith Oltay, OMRI, Inc.
|+ - ||Hungarian Hirlevel Free Trial Subscription (mind)
Hungarian Hirlevel, a weekly newsletter published in english,
deals exclusively with the events of Hungary.
The Hungarian Hirlevel staff lives in Hungary and is on the spot for
first hand interviews and observations.
Distribution is by fax or post.
Reply with name and fax number or address. Receive six weeks free trial
subscription. No obligation.
|+ - ||Unbearable Burdens (mind)
Prof. Agnew summarizes the views of Sandor Kopatsy on the forgiving of
Hungary's debts. The summary is the result of at least two successive
translations, which may have scrambled the original meaning somewhat.
I almost hope this is the case, because the end result is amazingly
incoherent. Kopatsy's articles in the 70s and 80s showed excellent
understanding of Western economics and politics. Here is Prof. Agnew's
summary of his views now:
> Basically he says that in the interests of the West, eastern and
> central Europe was handed over to Stalin and the USSR so that a
> threat to western Europe would exist, that would justify long-
> term US involvement in Europe after the war's end. The need for
> continued political and military presence gave the US "nearly
> unlimited influence." He says, "the United states gained as a
> result of the Soviet great-power threat many times more than the
> debt, which they should now forgive those countries that it
> sacrificed at the altar of its own interests at Yalta."
This is a remarkable variation of a mantra repeated ceaselessly by
nationalists of all stripes in Eastern Europe. The line runs as follows:
"We Serbs [Hungarians, Croatians...] have been the bastion protecting you
sybaritic Westerners from the onslaught of the Turks [or Tatars, or
Russians... pick one]. Therefore you owe us. Pay up, you bastards."
Somehow, this sort of argument failed to make any headway until now.
I doubt Kopatsy's version is likely to fare much better.
It's not just the fact that this kind of argument will not sway the
intended audience in the West. It is worse than counterproductive. It
perpetuates a belief in miracles: the myth that the solution to Hungary's
problems hinges on what others (foreign banks and governments) decide
to do; the myth that some magic wand may be waved somewhere, and then all
will be well. It points the finger somewhere else.
It is, in general, unwise to try to combine the role of the supplicant
with that of the fearless critic. You can be both, but not at the same
time, and not in the same sentence. Even assuming that a stockholder
or depositor of the Bank of America buys into Kopatsy's original theory
of the cold war, she will still not be very likely to open her purse
very wide. And Congress is even less likely to be moved by pangs of guilt
to indemnify those shareholders and depositors for the risks the bank took
with their money.
But Kopatsy's argument suffers from a much more obvious logical error.
Assume Kopatsy is right. Assume America the Sinister has arranged to have
the Eastern half of Europe under Soviet control for 45 years, as part of a
devious plan to dominate Western Europe. Then ask the obvious question:
when did the logic of this strategy stop working? Why shouldn't it be
working now? If it was ever in the American national interest to make sure
that the West faces a turbulent and threatening Eastern Europe, then the
best thing for the U.S. to do now is to turn the screws, offer no debt
relief, and create the maximum dislocation and instability in Eastern
Europe. The better to dominate poor downtrodden Western Europe, of
|+ - ||Searching for Roots (mind)
This is a re-post. I put an incorrect e-mail address. The one below is correct.
I am searching for my roots. Where do I start? My dad was born in 1931 in Backa
Topola, Hungary and is now part of Yugoslavia; it was a border town pre WWII.
I have little info to go on, but if anyone has any idea where to start, please
know. You can email me at .
|+ - ||Kollektiv level a Kormanynak (mind)
A FORUM olvasokozonsege ugy dontott, hogy az alapszerzodesek miatt
levelben fordulunk a Kormanyhoz. Minden hozzank csatlakozot orommel
varunk. Aki nem egyenileg kivan irni, es egyetert az alabbi levelben
foglaltakkal, az legyen szives kuldje el nekem a teljes nevet, es E-
mail cimet. Ez lesz az "alairasa" a level aljan. A levelet az ossze-
gyult alairasokkal egyutt, *egy peldanyban* fogjuk postazni.
Cimzett: Magyar Koztarsasag Kormanya
Targy: Magyar-Szlovak, Magyar-Roman alapszerzodes
Tisztelt Miniszter Urak, Miniszerelnok Ur !
Rendkivul nagy aggodalommal kovetjuk a Magyar Koztarsasag kormanya,
Romania valamint Szlovakia kozott, a megkotendo alapszerzodesek er-
dekeben folyo targyalasokat.
Megitelesunk szerint sem Romania, sem Szlovakia nem olyan szellemben
all a szerzodesek kerdeskorehez, amely Magyarorszag reszerol egy va-
lodi baratsagi szerzodes alapjaul elfogadhato lenne. Hianyoljuk az
erintett magyar kisebbsegek legalabb kulturalis onrendelkezesere vo-
natkozo es szamonkerheto garanciakat. Kritikusnak tartjuk, hogy az
emlitett kisebbsegek helyzetenek tenyleges javitasa helyett, altala-
nos igeretekert csereben Magyarorszag hatargaranciakra vonatkozo pon-
tok alairasat latolgatja.
Hatarozott velemenyunk szerint a szerzodesek megkotese nem javitja,
illetve a szerzodesek megkotesenek ideiglenes elhalasztasa nem fogja
rontani Magyarorszag eselyeit az Europai Kozosseg tagallamava valasa-
Hiszunk abban, hogy a hagyomanyosan jol funkcionalo magyar kulpoli-
tika kepes lesz a szerzodes meghiusulasaban rejlo nyilvanvalo takti-
kai lehetosegeket kihasznalni, Magyarorszag politikai sulyat a ter-
segben tovabb novelni.
|+ - ||Lost souls on the information superhighway (mind)
Maybe someone does not know it yet..
That our Usenet group is called
Now you know everything to find it, so we don't
have to change its name...
|+ - ||Re: Unbearable Burdens (mind)
Gabor Fencsik highlights what I thought strange about the argument that
Sa1ndor Kopa1tsy used (and of course, the translation of a translation
often leads to interesting results (just _how_ much salt, dear reader,
is there in that famous salami?))...
Does the argument that the West "ought" to forgive the debts of the emerging
economies of ECEurope really depend on such a revisionist reading of post-
And now, we have a 9 % devaluation of the forint, plus strong cutbacks in
social spending (specificaly, tuition at universities and reductions in
maternity payments, if I heard the BBC reports correctly). Was it really
necessary to dump Bekesi, to go ahead and put these programs into place?
|+ - ||Old Habits (mind)
Prof. Agnew asks:
> And now, we have a 9 % devaluation of the forint, plus strong cutbacks
> in social spending (specificaly, tuition at universities and reductions
> in maternity payments, if I heard the BBC reports correctly). Was it
> really necessary to dump Bekesi, to go ahead and put these programs
> into place?
I see this as further evidence that Mr Horn's mental habits, formed in
his long career as a party apparatchik, have not changed a whole lot.
His mind still operates as if he were running a one-party state. It is
one of the standard operating procedures of one-party systems that
first one smashes the intra-party opposition, and then one goes on to
implement its program.
On the positive side, Bekesi will probably go on to have a lucrative
career in private industry, where he will most likely do very well,
thank you. Ten years ago he might have been neutralized instead by
being made head of one of the innumerable research institutes of the
Academy of Sciences. Thirty years ago he would have had to work as a
lowly librarian. And forty years ago he might have been deported to an
inhospitable climate. So there is progress, after all.
|+ - ||Re: REQ: bills (mind)
Sorry, but if you have bills for your drinks - it is not an
English pub, but a restaurant! (I think it is the same for
the rest of the UK.) Will a "tab" do? (list
of drinks bought on credit, you have to be "torzsgarda".)
> My friend askd, to put on his letter.
> udv: parker
> So, here is the letter:
> Hi! (or Hello!) (perhabs Good afternoon, Sir!)
> We are hungarian students from Szeged ( this is a city of
> south-hungary ).
> Sorry about our bad english and good disturbing you
> - Here is a very humorous student competition,
> and we need some help from YOU, and from your
> - There's a task for our group:
> we have to collect as many bills as we can.
> But the bills have to be special pub-bills.
> Why special? Has to be on it four thing:
> 1. One mug of beer
> 2. about half a deciliter hard-drink (strong in
> alcohol like vodka, schnaps, rum, whiskey etc..)
> 3. the stamp of the pub
> 4. the sign of the waiter, or chief.
> If you don't hate the drink, and you are a cool boyorgirl,
> please send some bill for me until 1995.03.20 and tell this
> your friends too..
> Name: Leander (Laszlo Karman)
> Adress: Gaspar Zoltan u. 5/A II.em 4.
> Szeged 6723
> PS: if you want to use INTERNET, you can send a UUENCODE-
> coded Photo-copy of the bill to this e-mail adress:
> Thank you!